speaking in tongues question for christians

[Sephus]

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My own language has a vocabulary / syntax

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how do you know?

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but I could not translate it - for the majority of those(and I) who speak in tongues don't know what they are saying. The 'language' of tongues that most Christians speak is an unknown language that is a prayer language of sorts between a person and God. The reason that people do it is because it is because they believe it is beneficial to their spirit and others.

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do you think you could tell the difference between having a real prayer language and just believing you do? how?

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if (by your best guess) some, most, or all of them are "faking it" and just babbling, is this at all problematic for you?
If most are faking it then it means that people who label themselves Christians don't have a great deal of intellectual integrity.

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are you implying you don't think they're actually christians?

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i mean, these are sincere (for the most part) christians, right?
I have no way of knowing.

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i'm not really asking what you know, im asking what you think.

[stormstarter28]

I am a member of a church in which most members speak in tongues regularly; I personally have never done so, nor do I feel pressured by the group to do so. I believe it is not for everyone, but that it is real and a good way to communicate with God. I know these people very well, and can promise they are not "faking it" to fit into the group. They are sincere Christ followers who are connecting with God.
I have also heard of people speaking in tongues that have been translated to actual languages that the speaker was unaware of. I have never seen this myself, but I have heard of it happening. If it is true, I think it would be a very good argument for the existence of God...wouldn't you all agree?

It seems to me that there isn't much to argue about here. Most people who speak in tongues believe they really are speaking a language designed to communicate with God. Atheists obviously don't believe in it. I don't know what else to say about the subject.

[Sephus]

hi storm.

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I believe it is not for everyone, but that it is real and a good way to communicate with God.

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what makes it good? do the people understand what they're saying? if not, it seems strictly worse than using english, since god knows everything anyway.

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I know these people very well, and can promise they are not "faking it" to fit into the group. They are sincere Christ followers who are connecting with God.

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i meant for "faking it" to include being sincere about it, but wrong. should have been clearer.

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I have also heard of people speaking in tongues that have been translated to actual languages that the speaker was unaware of. If it is true, I think it would be a very good argument for the existence of God...wouldn't you all agree?

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yes, but so would a bleeding painting of mary, etc.

[Sephus]

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It seems to me that there isn't much to argue about here. Most people who speak in tongues believe they really are speaking a language designed to communicate with God. Atheists obviously don't believe in it. I don't know what else to say about the subject.


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i was mainly looking for the opinion of christians who don't believe in it, not necessarily to argue about it.

[stormstarter28]

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hi storm.

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I believe it is not for everyone, but that it is real and a good way to communicate with God.

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what makes it good? do the people understand what they're saying? if not, it seems strictly worse than using english, since god knows everything anyway.

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I know these people very well, and can promise they are not "faking it" to fit into the group. They are sincere Christ followers who are connecting with God.

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i meant for "faking it" to include being sincere about it, but wrong. should have been clearer.

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I have also heard of people speaking in tongues that have been translated to actual languages that the speaker was unaware of. If it is true, I think it would be a very good argument for the existence of God...wouldn't you all agree?

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yes, but so would a bleeding painting of mary, etc.

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What "makes it good" is that it is an intimate connection with God that is deeper than words can express, hence the uncomprehensible language.

You also said you were addressing the question to Christians who don't believe in speaking in tongues...I believe (I'm not 100%, but I'm almost positive) that speaking in tongues is biblical (New Testament), so if they don't believe in it, I would like to know why they are ignoring the scripture.

[PairTheBoard]

I suspect the people who engage in the speaking of tongues find it a kind of ecstatic experience which they feel brings them closer to God. Although it has the surface form of language it amounts to something more like the language of dance, or jazz, or modern abstract art. It conveys meaning similiar to the way those languages do. I see it as a sort of raw emotional approach to connecting and communing with God - or the Holy Spirit if you will - which also connects with others in the Group, raising the emotional-spiritual level of the entire group like a chain reaction. If you've ever witnessed this kind of thing you can't help but feel an emotional impact, even if nothing more than being struck by its oddness. I grew up next door to a Church that engaged in it and we often heard the wailing from the services. I always thought it quite odd and many of my friends ridiculed it. But you couldn't deny that it evoked something psychologically and emotionally very powerful.

Some Christians probably condemn it. I think a lot of Christians don't condemn it but also don't want to engage in it out of aversion to the raw emotionality of the practice. This is kind of a funny topic for me because in the denomination where I grew up, the minister was very straight laced and thought the best way to grow the congregation was to attract the wealthy and influencial people in town to it. I was rather suprised to later learn, after I had stopped attending for a number of years, that the same minister had become sold on this kind of worship service and had converted the congregation to emoting and tongue speaking.

I think it all depends on how you look at it. If you are an atheist it is a psychological and emotional phenomenon with a group dynamic. I wouldn't call that "fake". It's just not the same description as believers would apply. That could be said about almost everything in the religion.

PairTheBoard

[Subfallen]

If you're really interested, Daniel Wegner gives some context to speaking in tongues (The Illusion of Conscious Will) by comparing glossolalia with other experiences of "virtual agency" such as channeling, multiple personality disorder, etc.

[Sephus]

that looks interesting, thanks

[entertainme]

This should answer many of your questions about how speaking in tongues and spiritual gifts are viewed in the modern christian church.

This page specifically deals with speaking in tongues.

Both biblically and in modern literature there are examples of two types of manifestation:

- the person praying or speaking does not know the language, yet speaks and is understood by a native in the language.
- a private language spoken in prayer to God, not identifiable, (sometimes followed by an "interpretation" from the same source or another source)

From the Wikipedia page:

Elsewhere in the New Testament some scholars say Paul describes the experience as speaking in an "unknown tongue". In I Corinthians 14:2 The King James Version has word 'unknown' in italics, indicating the word "unknown" does not appear in the original Greek manuscripts. Paul refers to tongues again in (1 Cor 14:14-19). Speaking in tongues is equivalent to speaking in foreign languages. Although the Apostle Paul commands church brethren, "Do not forbid speaking in tongues" (1 Cor 14:39), and that he wishes those to whom he wrote "all spoke with tongues" (1 Cor 14:5) and claims himself to speak with tongues more than all of the church at Corinth combined ("I thank my God I speak with tongues more than you all" 1 Cor 14:18), Paul discourages simultaneous speaking in tongues directed at people rather than God, lest unbelievers think the assembled brethren "mad" (1 Cor 14:23, 27). Tongues, says Paul, is speaking to God, rather than men, mysteries in the spirit (1 Cor 14:2), edifies the tongues-speaker (1 Cor 14:4), is the action of the praying of a person's spirit (1 Cor 14:14), and serves to bless God and give thanks (1 Cor 14:16-17).

[godBoy]

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My own language has a vocabulary / syntax

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how do you know?

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In the sense that there are different 'words' and patterns of speech.
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but I could not translate it - for the majority of those(and I) who speak in tongues don't know what they are saying. The 'language' of tongues that most Christians speak is an unknown language that is a prayer language of sorts between a person and God. The reason that people do it is because it is because they believe it is beneficial to their spirit and others.

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do you think you could tell the difference between having a real prayer language and just believing you do? how?


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Well, Christians believe that it effects the spirit - so what we see it as a spiritual experience - you may refer to it as purely emotional or a psychological one - But it definitely does have an impact.
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if (by your best guess) some, most, or all of them are "faking it" and just babbling, is this at all problematic for you?

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If most are faking it then it means that people who label themselves Christians don't have a great deal of intellectual integrity.

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are you implying you don't think they're actually christians?

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Sorry - I meant to say "If most are faking it then it means that there are some people who label themselves Christians that don't have a great deal of intellectual integrity."
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I mean, these are sincere (for the most part) christians, right?
I have no way of knowing.

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i'm not really asking what you know, im asking what you think.

[/ QUOTE ]I've said that those who fake it - aren't being honest with themselves, hence the comment about their lack of intellectual integrity.