Theory Q on Continuation bets

[thedustbustr]

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Seemingly its right to do it 100% of the time until people start to play back at you.

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no

for example, not when you have a weak 1 pair hand with showdown value, and a bet has no chance of folding a higher pair. why would you ever bet? better hands call it, and worse hands (that are drawing to only 6 outs or less) fold, and you want to play a small pot with your small hand

[lsaw2]

I didn't mean blindly betting with underpairs at every chance but the c-bet is such an effective weapon it's important to use it as much as possible I find. It amazes me how often people fold to them.

[thedustbustr]

but sometimes you dont need to make them fold because you have the best hand !!!

i'll repeat it

SOMETIMES YOU HAVE THE BEST HAND! SO WHY WOULD YOU WANT THEM TO FOLD!!

sorry, im just an ass

[awvdh]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Seemingly its right to do it 100% of the time until people start to play back at you.

[/ QUOTE ]
no

for example, not when you have a weak 1 pair hand with showdown value, and a bet has no chance of folding a higher pair. why would you ever bet? better hands call it, and worse hands (that are drawing to only 6 outs or less) fold, and you want to play a small pot with your small hand

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Suppose you're in CO with 33, you bet and only BB calls. Flop comes T72, BB checks. Would you check behind here? You still have a turn and a river to play. I rather know where I stand right at the flop, aggressive opponents pick up on a flop check immediately by betting out the turn OOP no matter what.

[thedustbustr]

its not about knowing where you stand. if you check, you're giving up the pot if he bets, but at ssnl, they just check it down with you, and you ship it with your 33, and lose no more money if they already paired on you.

but this may be a goot spot to cbet, because a bet will make 44,55,66 and sometimes 88-99 and deuces to fold.

on the other hand, if your opponents will always peel with 44-99 and any pair (sounds like your avg ssnl donk to me) a bet is bad, and a check is good, because hands you beat have only 6 outs, but hands you are behind are never folding to a flop peel. and 33 on this board is not exactly a great spot to double barrel.

[thedustbustr]

ill also yield that plenty of people are successfully beating the games cbetting all the time -- xorbie adamantly defended a cbet in a thread two weeks ago that i thought was awful (he's wrong) -- so if you don't believe me then do your thing. but i will adamantly tell you that it's a leak.

[lsaw2]

That's no prob i'll listen to you but i'll also say what I think and take a good ol'flaming, it's one of the best ways to learn. In that example I would c-bet.

Ok so what you keep repeating () is that though you are ahead it is so marginal its very hard to get other hands to fold, so rather protect your edge/ability to control pot size as opposed to c-betting? I completely understand if that's what you mean, if not, put me in my place :P

[Kilillan]

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I didn't mean blindly betting with underpairs at every chance but the c-bet is such an effective weapon it's important to use it as much as possible I find. It amazes me how often people fold to them.

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people fold to them less and less the higher you go. It becomes less profitable.

I think I c-bet around 60% of the time

[tufat23]

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3bet paired flops every once in a while. You'd be surprised how often those min-checkraises are just small pocket pairs that don't think you hit.

Example: Villain is 25/13/2.x

Full Tilt Poker
$0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em Ring Game
5 Players
LegoPoker Hand Converter

<font color="black">Stack Sizes</font>
UTG: $197.15
Hero (MP): $112.20
CO: $98.50
SB: $133.45
BB: $81.3

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($1.5, 5 players)
UTG folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $3.50</font>, CO folds, SB folds, BB calls $2.50

<font color="black">Flop:</font> 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($7.5, 2 players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $6</font>, <font color="red">BB raises to $12</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $35</font>, BB folds
Uncalled bet of $23 returned to Hero

<font color="black">Turn:</font> 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [] ($31.5, 1 players)
No action

<font color="black">River:</font> 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [] ($31.5, 1 players)
No action

His range here basically for calling is like small PPs, suited cards not including 2 and high cards. Being that we raised the button, he's likely making a play here pretty liberally. Of course a push would mean a slowplayed high pair or 66 but this rarely if ever happens. I think your average villain will fold all but TT+ to this raise as well as the rare 66 and 2x.

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i'd fold preflop

[thedustbustr]

thats about right