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#11
11-12-2006, 04:57 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
Calling in these situations makes me sick...you got a monster and there's no way I don't push this hand. If you're too scared to get it in set vs. set then leave a table when you get beyond your comfort level.
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#13
11-12-2006, 04:59 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] oh ... and dont c-bet that flop ... thats really terrible because it hit so many possible hands hes holding. [/ QUOTE ] I disagree, the c-bet is fine. It is heads up and you raised pre-flop and you cannot let overcards or clubs draw for free. Against more than one opponent I might think about not c-betting here, but not in position on a single opponent that from the sounds of it, can fold when he doesn't have a hand. [/ QUOTE ] i suppose youre right .. id just expect to get check raised here a lot cuz these villains are so bad and wont bet this flop w/ top pr ... but also i guess betting is the only way youre going to take this pot down ... so i cant really argue with that. [/ QUOTE ] You can't worry about getting check raised in spots like this. If that was the plan then he's going to fire the turn anyway and you're only saving a couple of bucks but losing out on far more hands where he fires the turn but would've folded the flop.
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#14
11-12-2006, 05:02 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
Calling in these situations makes me sick...you got a monster and there's no way I don't push this hand. If you're too scared to get it in set vs. set then leave a table when you get beyond your comfort level. [/ QUOTE ] I think this is fine thinking 99% of the time but once we get 300BB deep we really should be looking to have a hand a lot closer to the nuts than normal. Do you really believe villains at this level are capable of massive c/r bluffs with nothing but a busted flush? Especially against a hero that has fired strong on all 3 streets after a PFR?
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#15
11-12-2006, 05:03 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
I run into tons of players like this at FT. They cc preflop with garbage hoping to hit big and get paid off. At this level they do get paid off hence his big stack. They are also smart enough to get away when behind. Villains hand can easily be things like J6s and T6s too. I'm in the push camp here.
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#16
11-12-2006, 05:05 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] oh ... and dont c-bet that flop ... thats really terrible because it hit so many possible hands hes holding. [/ QUOTE ] I disagree, the c-bet is fine. It is heads up and you raised pre-flop and you cannot let overcards or clubs draw for free. Againt st more than one opponent I might think about not c-betting here, but not in position on a single opponent that from the sounds of it, can fold when he doesn't have a hand. [/ QUOTE ] i suppose youre right .. id just expect to get check raised here a lot cuz these villains are so bad and wont bet this flop w/ top pr ... but also i guess betting is the only way youre going to take this pot down ... so i cant really argue with that. [/ QUOTE ] You can't worry about getting check raised in spots like this. If that was the plan then he's going to fire the turn anyway and you're only saving a couple of bucks but losing out on far more hands where he fires the turn but would've folded the flop. [/ QUOTE ] i wasnt worried about it ... lol id just expect it to happen fairly often ... that doesnt change the fact that i agree .. c-bet here is fine if we raise pf and he checks flop to us. i just wouldnt be playing the hand any further if i encountered resistance ... that is ... until that 8 pops up on the turn
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#17
11-12-2006, 05:07 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] oh ... and dont c-bet that flop ... thats really terrible because it hit so many possible hands hes holding. [/ QUOTE ] I disagree, the c-bet is fine. It is heads up and you raised pre-flop and you cannot let overcards or clubs draw for free. Againt st more than one opponent I might think about not c-betting here, but not in position on a single opponent that from the sounds of it, can fold when he doesn't have a hand. [/ QUOTE ] i suppose youre right .. id just expect to get check raised here a lot cuz these villains are so bad and wont bet this flop w/ top pr ... but also i guess betting is the only way youre going to take this pot down ... so i cant really argue with that. [/ QUOTE ] You can't worry about getting check raised in spots like this. If that was the plan then he's going to fire the turn anyway and you're only saving a couple of bucks but losing out on far more hands where he fires the turn but would've folded the flop. [/ QUOTE ] i wasnt worried about it ... lol id just expect it to happen fairly often ... that doesnt change the fact that i agree .. c-bet here is fine if we raise pf and he checks flop to us. i just wouldnt be playing the hand any further if i encountered resistance ... that is ... until that 8 pops up on the turn [/ QUOTE ] Without the 8 on the turn I'm checking behind and looking to get a cheap showdown on a non-flush board.
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#18
11-12-2006, 05:16 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
i just wouldnt be playing the hand any further if i encountered resistance ... that is ... until that 8 pops up on the turn [/ QUOTE ] Yes this was the plan. The c-bet is pretty much 100% for me here when this deep with any 2 I would have raised PF with. I was about to shut down but the 8 on the turn gave me a nice oppportunity to "2nd barrel". Hardest decision was the river obv. TBH I didn't really consider folding this hand until thinking about it afterwards. My biggest reason for not folding was because 6's full looked like a easy possibility. But this deep, can calling be more appropriate? Or am I thinking weak here?
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#19
11-12-2006, 05:19 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] i just wouldnt be playing the hand any further if i encountered resistance ... that is ... until that 8 pops up on the turn [/ QUOTE ] Yes this was the plan. The c-bet is pretty much 100% for me here when this deep with any 2 I would have raised PF with. I was about to shut down but the 8 on the turn gave me a nice oppportunity to "2nd barrel". Hardest decision was the river obv. TBH I didn't really consider folding this hand until thinking about it afterwards. My biggest reason for not folding was because 6's full looked like a easy possibility. But this deep, can calling be more appropriate? Or am I thinking weak here? [/ QUOTE ] Everyone in both forums seems to be strongly in the push camp but personally I'd just call since I don't think his range is as big as everyone else. I think its safe to say that you won't be in this position often enough for it to drastically affect your long term results [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
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#20
11-12-2006, 05:22 PM
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Re: Fold a boat? over 300bb deep
as i look over it again i think the chances he has 1010 or JJ are pretty low since these are hands he def. woulda raised.
with that in mind i think that makes 66 really the only hand we are worried about (however we really cant worry about it that much)... you are getting a very good chance to make a big score w/ a concealed hand ... i think u should take it.
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