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#11
09-25-2006, 10:20 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
[ QUOTE ]
lol @ being results oriented ur a big dog when u bet the turn and everyone doesn't fold. u want to showdown as cheaply as possibly and if ur lucky u can fold the river without having to pay anything [/ QUOTE ] Just to clarify: Are you suggesting that you would check behind on the turn and fold the river for one bet? Or that you might get "lucky" if it's 2 bets back and then you know you have an easy fold? Luke 
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#12
09-25-2006, 10:20 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
before the Trn CR:99+,A2s+,K2s+,QTs+,Qd9d,Qd8d,Q7s-Q2s,J2s+,T9s,9d8d,A2o+,K2o+,Q7o+,J7o+,T9o,98o
plus some other XdXd hands. A loose passive called a raise in the BB, called a bet, then a raise on a scary board, and is still present when the Turn when the board gets worse for us. OMG, WHAT'LL WE DO? Gehrig your argument is to give up any piece of value we can get on this Turn, in order to make it easier for our opponents to decieve us on the river.
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#13
09-25-2006, 10:27 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
[ QUOTE ]
before the Trn CR:99+,A2s+,K2s+,QTs+,Qd9d,Qd8d,Q7s-Q2s,J2s+,T9s,9d8d,A2o+,K2o+,Q7o+,J7o+,T9o,98o plus some other XdXd hands. [/ QUOTE ] what is he calling the turn with? what is he raising with? what is he folding? how costly is a check vs a hand he folds? ur a dog vs the range u gave. if both opponents have that range u have 20% equity
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#14
09-25-2006, 10:28 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] lol @ being results oriented ur a big dog when u bet the turn and everyone doesn't fold. u want to showdown as cheaply as possibly and if ur lucky u can fold the river without having to pay anything [/ QUOTE ] Just to clarify: Are you suggesting that you would check behind on the turn and fold the river for one bet? Or that you might get "lucky" if it's 2 bets back and then you know you have an easy fold? Luke [/ QUOTE ] i would typically call 1 on the river
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#15
09-25-2006, 10:43 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
The play here is to check behind on the turn since one or both of your opponents may have the straight. Then you call a river bet.
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#16
09-25-2006, 11:16 AM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
If the guy is super passive and suddenly wakes up with a decidely non passive check-raise when the final card to a straight that makes sense with his starting hand range and play up to that point then surely check the turn and maybe call the river.
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#17
09-25-2006, 01:22 PM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
[ QUOTE ]
... but I do have redraws to what's beating me, and I will be getting odds to draw. [/ QUOTE ] "I will be getting odds to draw" is actually an argument for checking the turn, not betting it. Those times you can safely fold to a turn raise/check-raise are the times you would be more likely to make thin value bets. Otherwise, you end up putting in two turn bets in those situations (like here) when you would have much rather put in none.
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#18
09-25-2006, 04:40 PM
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Re: River decision 2 Pair vs. A passive player
Either you or your opponents are probably drawing to 4 outs or fewer on the turn. The only likely exception is diamonds, and BB is unlikely to semibluff c/r the turn with them, "potential semibluffer" read notwithstanding. We either take the info we've been given and fold the river, or we check behind on the turn and call 1 river bet. I prefer the latter. 3 BB is too much to spend getting to showdown UI.
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