Thou Shall Not Cold Call More Than Once Every Three Hours

[7stud]

[ QUOTE ]
Anyone who reads Small Stakes Hold'em or these boards and comes out with the "don't play anything less than QQ or AK for a raise pre-flop" is simply misreading things.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, this is what it says:



[/ QUOTE ]When someone raises, it typically indicates a strong hand. Unless you are in the big blind you should usually play only hands that are strong enough to reraise the raiser(against a tight raiser, pocket aces through jacks and ace-king). If the pot is very likely to be multiway, you can flat call with a few other hands, specifically smaller pocket pairs and some strong suited hands(e.g. QhJh). Two or three other hands--AQs, AJs, and KQs--are also usually marginally profitable. You should fold everything else. This means you must play extremely tightly if someone has raised in front of you.

Many of your opponents will have neither the knowledge nor the discipline to fold so many hands.
(Small Stakes Hold'em, p. 61-62)


[/ QUOTE ]

However, other statements in the book temper that blanket prohibition against cold calling with any other hands.

[ QUOTE ]
For example, behind an open-raise and two cold-calls, I would say that cold-calling with hands like A9s, 65s, or 33 is completely standard and folding would be a pretty large error.

[/ QUOTE ]

In regards to A9s, the authors say:

[ QUOTE ]
Usually, fold all these hands, however, if it is raised in front of you. Cold calling raises with these hands in short handed pots is a common and costly mistake. (p. 70)

[/ QUOTE ]

The blanket prohibition they state in the first sentence against cold calling with A9s is tempered by the reasoning they list in the second sentence. They imply that if the pot is multiway(3 players? Or, do you need more?), then it would be correct to play.

In regards to 65s, they say:

[ QUOTE ]
Fold if the pot has been raised in front of you unless there are many players already in, and you have one of the stronger hands of this category.

[/ QUOTE ]

Is 65s one of the stronger hands in the category: T9s-54s, J9s-64s, Q9s-96s, Q8s, J7s? Looking at my Advanced Hold'em book, 65s just makes into the top 50% of those hands. Is that strong enough?

In regards to 33, they say:

[ QUOTE ]
If it has been raised in front of you, to play you must be almost sure the pot will be five handed or more. You need a multiway pot to compensate for the extra money you will put in before the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

With each extra bet you put in preflop, the harder it becomes to get paid the correct odds you need for flopping a set. If you assume that you need 10:1 to compensate you for flopping a set, then when you call two bets preflop, you have to collect 20 bets from your opponents. With only three other opponents contributing 6 bets preflop, that means you need to collect 14 bets on the flop, turn, and river. If you flop a set and all 3 of your opponents call your bets on the flop, turn, and river, you will earn 15 bets. Is that a reasonably attainable goal? I would think on average you aren't going to make it, and therefore 33 should be folded when there are only 3 other players and it's two bets to call.

[ QUOTE ]
JJ and TT are both very standard three-betting hands in a majority of situations.

[/ QUOTE ]

In regards to those two hands, the authors say

[ QUOTE ]
It is also usually right to reraise if it has been raised once.(p. 66)

[/ QUOTE ]

You say it is correct to make it 3 bets in a majority of situations, but that is not what the authors appear to be saying--they imply that if there are two raises ahead of you, then you shouldn't raise. Who's right?

[KHALI]

I was not intending to paraphrase SSHE in my post when I said cold calling was being first caller but meant that it was seen as a common mistake to be that first caller with less than a very strong hand and then you should often be reraising but that it is not always incorrect to call a raise with less than premium if the pot is multiway already. I think Deranged said what I meant but better

"The main prohibition against cold-calling involves cold-calling in a pot where no one else has entered, or where you are in early position against an EP raiser, or where there is a threat you will not get a multiway pot. In general, the "Don't Cold-Call" rules apply to situations where you will likely get short-handed action "

[Elevens]

Okay, I didn't read this thread when it first appeared (I just caught it in the digest). Now that I have, I'm kind of disappointed it ended the way it did. I felt like I was left hanging for a final resolution.

[brettbrettr]

[ QUOTE ]
Coldcalling is fine in the right situations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Relative position is important, too.

[Frank Zappy]

There will not be a final resolution that will have all in agreement.

I believe that CC is more a function of the Table than anything else and, if circumstances present, I will CC UTG+1 with KJs, Axs, and any PP.

I posted this after sitting at a table where the guy on my right had a VPIP of over 50% and was comfortable about raising with any number of bizarre holdings. Therefore, I believe that under those circumstance one can discard the advise about CC and not face eternal damnation in some Poker Hell for going against what I’ve heard called “Gospel” here. Hey, I read “The DaVinci Code” I know the Gospels ain’t always well, gospel.

[Bluffoon]

[ QUOTE ]
There will not be a final resolution that will have all in agreement.

I believe that CC is more a function of the Table than anything else and, if circumstances present, I will CC UTG+1 with KJs, Axs, and any PP.

I posted this after sitting at a table where the guy on my right had a VPIP of over 50% and was comfortable about raising with any number of bizarre holdings. Therefore, I believe that under those circumstance one can discard the advise about CC and not face eternal damnation in some Poker Hell for going against what I’ve heard called “Gospel” here. Hey, I read “The DaVinci Code” I know the Gospels ain’t always well, gospel.

[/ QUOTE ]

If the guy on my right is playing 50% of his hands and raising with most of them I am not coldcalling with playable hands I am three betting. You want to isolate someone like this. As the posters say above there are plenty of spots where cold calling is correct but if your hand is good enough to cold call with reraising is often the better play.

[Frank Zappy]

D'oh! That's perfect! That's my "I Could have had a V-8!" Moment.