Big Laydowns at High Stakes Poker (specifically Daniel Negreanu)

[corsakh]

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NYCNative,

per the defition of a strong player via HSNL standards, i think the only players that would meet that criteria from the first 2 seasons would be Alaei, Esfandiari, and to some extent Laak. the others are simple either bad or lack a lot of experience from NL cashgames bc they play big stakes LIMIT.

ofc other players are good, obv, (ie harman, brunsons, hansen) but that lineup is generally very soft when compared to the strongest 25/50+ online players like BlD, RekRuL, aba20, Antonius (the latter 2 are in HSP 3 lol).

dont assume bc they are on TV playing big stakes zomg that they are superstars, esp Negreanu. he made so many bad plays and calldowns it was hilarious. i dont think he made a single river fold or non-retardedly loose flop/turn peel.

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You have to acknowledge that it probably takes some skill to be widely regarded as one of the best poker pros alive according to media and poker stat sites.

It takes some skill to routinely win several WSOP bracelets.

It takes some skill to win a few million dollars in tournamnet money alone.

It takes some skill to get to play on TV in front of millions of viewers.

Then it also takes some ... decide for yourself what it takes...

to assume that tv companies are charitable organizations or they have many other ways to attract the audiene other than big names, big pots, bad beats and cocktail waitresses

to assume that someone who makes a fortune out of this game is making kiddy moves on tv because hes ignorant or amateur

to assume that a bunch of hardcore poker pros in a high stakes full ring game would see the flop like 40 percent of the time ... like for real

to assume that the way you see they play on tv is the way they really do

[Eclipse86]

[ QUOTE ]
NYCNative,

per the defition of a strong player via HSNL standards, i think the only players that would meet that criteria from the first 2 seasons would be Alaei, Esfandiari, and to some extent Laak. the others are simple either bad or lack a lot of experience from NL cashgames bc they play big stakes LIMIT.

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you missed mentioning Barry, and his ex-gf Mimi Tran

[Lestat]

First realize that in limit poker, a bad laydown is considerably more expensive than a bad call. So if you're going to err, you almost always err on the side of calling the last bet.

That said, great players even in limit games are capable of some remarkable laydowns. This is especially true when they are against other not-so-great players who they can easily read. I don't watch TV, but I suspect that Negreanu's opponent was a competent player in his own right. Meaning, Negreanu can be almost certain he's beat, he can't be sure enough given the pot odds he's getting to call.

There is also meta-game considerations. I will sometimes pay off a river bet more for the purpose of letting an opponent know that I won't be bluffed.

Lastly, it's entirely possible that Negreanu was on tilt. When you're getting hammered like that, even the best players can lose their composure for a hand or two.