gawd, weakest over pair...

[viper930]

raising from the button is standard here.

[Paul Thomson]

[ QUOTE ]
why wouldn't u raise here? preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

You're getting good odds to limp. If you raise and get called in a couple places, than it's the suck. Most flops will be hard to play if you don't flop a set, even though you will have position.

[Paul Thomson]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

PF: I like a call. No need to raise here.


[/ QUOTE ]

wtf no

[/ QUOTE ]

wtf...yes. see previous post for explanation.

[Redd]

I don't get why we're folding the turn - isnt this 55/66 fairly often? It seems like 88, 99 are a possibility but he'll usually raise this pf. And he'll almost always pfr TT+. And there's still more 55/66 combos than 22/33/44.

[Paul Thomson]

[ QUOTE ]
raising from the button is standard here.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it is. but maybe the standard is wrong...limping cannot be losing that much value. 77 is a pretty weak hand...how low of a pocket pair would u raise, 55?

I like a raise alot more with 1 limper as opposed to two. With two limpers, you're getting great odds to call and hit a set. Also if you raise and the first limper calls than the 2nd limper is more likely to call.

In which case, you've got a big pot that you have to try and take down against 2 people when 7 out of 8 times, you're going to miss the flop. So you're going to make a big continuation bet on a flop which often will have at least a couple over cards.

Think how much easier it is to play the hand by limping. I doubt you give up much if any value and you make your post flop decisions 100 times more simple.

[carnivalhobo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
raising from the button is standard here.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it is. but maybe the standard is wrong...limping cannot be losing that much value. 77 is a pretty weak hand...how low of a pocket pair would u raise, 55?

I like a raise alot more with 1 limper as opposed to two. With two limpers, you're getting great odds to call and hit a set. Also if you raise and the first limper calls than the 2nd limper is more likely to call.

In which case, you've got a big pot that you have to try and take down against 2 people when 7 out of 8 times, you're going to miss the flop. So you're going to make a big continuation bet on a flop which often will have at least a couple over cards.

Think how much easier it is to play the hand by limping. I doubt you give up much if any value and you make your post flop decisions 100 times more simple.

[/ QUOTE ]

opening any pp from any position for a raise is standard around these parts, all the winning players do it

[bilbo-san]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
why wouldn't u raise here? preflop

[/ QUOTE ]

You're getting good odds to limp. If you raise and get called in a couple places, than it's the suck. Most flops will be hard to play if you don't flop a set, even though you will have position.

[/ QUOTE ]

Most flops won't be hard to play at all. If you get it heads up and it's checked to you, bet.

If you get it 3-ways and it's checked to you, bet a lot of dry flops.

That wasn't so hard.

Raising preflop is ueber-standard.

[Paul Thomson]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
raising from the button is standard here.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it is. but maybe the standard is wrong...limping cannot be losing that much value. 77 is a pretty weak hand...how low of a pocket pair would u raise, 55?

I like a raise alot more with 1 limper as opposed to two. With two limpers, you're getting great odds to call and hit a set. Also if you raise and the first limper calls than the 2nd limper is more likely to call.

In which case, you've got a big pot that you have to try and take down against 2 people when 7 out of 8 times, you're going to miss the flop. So you're going to make a big continuation bet on a flop which often will have at least a couple over cards.

Think how much easier it is to play the hand by limping. I doubt you give up much if any value and you make your post flop decisions 100 times more simple.

[/ QUOTE ]

opening any pp from any position for a raise is standard around these parts, all the winning players do it

[/ QUOTE ]

i know this...but what if there are 2 limpers?

[carnivalhobo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
raising from the button is standard here.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it is. but maybe the standard is wrong...limping cannot be losing that much value. 77 is a pretty weak hand...how low of a pocket pair would u raise, 55?

I like a raise alot more with 1 limper as opposed to two. With two limpers, you're getting great odds to call and hit a set. Also if you raise and the first limper calls than the 2nd limper is more likely to call.

In which case, you've got a big pot that you have to try and take down against 2 people when 7 out of 8 times, you're going to miss the flop. So you're going to make a big continuation bet on a flop which often will have at least a couple over cards.

Think how much easier it is to play the hand by limping. I doubt you give up much if any value and you make your post flop decisions 100 times more simple.

[/ QUOTE ]

opening any pp from any position for a raise is standard around these parts, all the winning players do it

[/ QUOTE ]

i know this...but what if there are 2 limpers?

[/ QUOTE ]

even with 2 limpers 77 is fine IMO, maybe with 22/33 id consider limping behind.

[bilbo-san]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
raising from the button is standard here.

[/ QUOTE ]

maybe it is. but maybe the standard is wrong...limping cannot be losing that much value. 77 is a pretty weak hand...how low of a pocket pair would u raise, 55?

I like a raise alot more with 1 limper as opposed to two. With two limpers, you're getting great odds to call and hit a set. Also if you raise and the first limper calls than the 2nd limper is more likely to call.

In which case, you've got a big pot that you have to try and take down against 2 people when 7 out of 8 times, you're going to miss the flop. So you're going to make a big continuation bet on a flop which often will have at least a couple over cards.

Think how much easier it is to play the hand by limping. I doubt you give up much if any value and you make your post flop decisions 100 times more simple.

[/ QUOTE ]

This has been discussed ad nauseum -- the easiest way to play a hand is not always (and in fact usually isn't) the most profitable way to play it.

I mean, the easiest way to play this hand is to fold it, after all.

And you're wrong about how much EV you are giving up. You're on the button. Considering how much more profitable the button is than every other position, you are giving up a lot not raising here.