($55s): AK facing big stack min raise.

[wuwei]

I agree with Yugo that pushing would probably be +EV (which is why I said it's fine), but it's so suboptimal that I'll also concede to the terrible crowd.

I see Yugo has now changed his reraise amount to 700 - why is that? I still think 550 or so accomplishes similar things but keeps the pot a little more manageable. It just doesn't build quite as big of a pot from a value perspective. If I thought 700 was significantly more likely to get a preflop fold out of this guy, then I'm on board. But bad players with monster stacks seem likely to call 550 or 700 without much thought.

Getting back to the question of what kind of bad player we're dealing with, I'll change my answer a bit and suggest that more predictable guys I like to raise and isolate. Against wilder players, just calling sounds good to me now.

[The Yugoslavian]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with Yugo that pushing would probably be +EV (which is why I said it's fine), but it's so suboptimal that I'll also concede to the terrible crowd.

I see Yugo has now changed his reraise amount to 700 - why is that? I still think 550 or so accomplishes similar things but keeps the pot a little more manageable. It just doesn't build quite as big of a pot from a value perspective. If I thought 700 was significantly more likely to get a preflop fold out of this guy, then I'm on board. But bad players with monster stacks seem likely to call 550 or 700 without much thought.

Getting back to the question of what kind of bad player we're dealing with, I'll change my answer a bit and suggest that more predictable guys I like to raise and isolate. Against wilder players, just calling sounds good to me now.

[/ QUOTE ]

I changed it? Well the whole time I've thought I'd make a 600-700 raise....meh a bit less is probably fine vs. this opponent too....generally I don't like to minreraise b/c I think it makes my opponents be extra wary when an A or K hits and I that's where most of the post flop value comes from. Even 500 or 550 looks a bit weird here IMO.....but ok I like 600 as it keeps the pot reasonable.....and 700 seems most "normal" as a reraise amount to me.

Frankly, I'm not sure it matters much whether you raise 550 or 700 here or somewhere in between. I think over 700 and you cannot control the pot post flop well and anything below 550 starts to possibly influence your opponent to not give you action on A or K flops or allow others to flat call.

Yugoslav

[DevinLake]

Ok, now what? SB is 2+2er who knows me and I know him.

PartyPoker $55 Speed Tournament, Big Blind is t100 (8 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

UTG (t2010)
UTG+1 (t1275)
MP1 (t6025)
Hero (t3890)
CO (t1520)
Button (t2030)
SB (t1640)
BB (t1610)

Preflop: Hero is in MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
<font color="gray">UTG folds</font>, <font color="gray">UTG+1 folds</font>, <font color="red">MP1 raises to t200</font>, Hero calls t200, <font color="gray">CO folds</font>, <font color="gray">Button folds</font>, <font color="red">SB raises to t1640 (all-in)</font>, <font color="gray">BB folds</font>, MP1 calls t1440, Hero ????

[SenorBeef]

Push. Dead money if you can isolate, and if you can't, it's not likely that you're not getting good odds on the three way action.

You have just enough chips to make folding an option for the other guy.. folding here is too weak, and calling leaves you putting in almost half your stack hoping for a flop.

[DevinLake]

[ QUOTE ]
folding here is too weak

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you give some reasoning here?

[SenorBeef]

There's no evidence that the SB has you beat - there's a high chance you have him dominated. He's just trying to steal a sizable pot from what he perceives are weak people.

As such, a good player even, but especially a bad player in the MP doesn't have to have much of a hand to call. If he's donkish, he probably calls here with 99-QQ, and quite possibly AQ, AJ.

There's a chance the SB walked into aces (unlikely since he'd tried to milk more out of the pot) or that the MP has been slow playing this whole time. It's a small percent of the hands he can hold, and a risk you'd just have to take. If he has something strong enough to call a weak bet from the SB, but not a reraise from you (say, any pair up to about jacks), or some crap like KJs, you can get a fold out of him. You'd get a call from maybe JJ and probably QQ, and that's +ev 3 way assuming the SB is weak. You might even get a call from AQ, which is fine.

[AliasMrJones]

[ QUOTE ]
There's no evidence that the SB has you beat - there's a high chance you have him dominated. He's just trying to steal a sizable pot from what he perceives are weak people.

...assuming the SB is weak. You might even get a call from AQ, which is fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

Just out of curiosity, what do you define as weak for SB? What kinds of hands do you think SB is pushing with?

[wpr101]

I like a call here pre. Or a reraise to 600.

[PokerSpiv]

I don't like a reraise here at all. If the minraiser is a donk as read, he is going to push with all sorts of rubbish, and you are going to have to fold.

You are in a good position in this tournament. Pushing all your chips in preflop with AK at this point is ridiculous gambling.

Just call and double up on any ace or king.

[SenorBeef]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like a reraise here at all. If the minraiser is a donk as read, he is going to push with all sorts of rubbish, and you are going to have to fold.


[/ QUOTE ]

Depends on what kind of donk he is. Donk doesn't mean overly aggressive (does it?). The OP mentioned him doubling him up with A6, but without the whole story. He may just be very loose passive, in which case you lose fold equity but gain in calls with dominated hands.

[ QUOTE ]

You are in a good position in this tournament. Pushing all your chips in preflop with AK at this point is ridiculous gambling.


[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not saying it's the clear only move, but calling it "ridiculous gambling" is very tight-weak. Most of the time there you end up racing with better than 2:1 odds against the SB. Sometimes the MP calls you with AQ on down. It's high variance, but you're rarely -EV, and it sets you up for good chip position to win it.

[ QUOTE ]

Just call and double up on any ace or king.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's an option, but now you're putting in more than 2/5ths of your stack hoping for something that's only going to hit 1/3rd of the time (on the flop).