Why does it matter if Hitler was atheist/Christian...??

[Splendour]

Well I have trouble seeing Hitler as a true follower of any religion since he was mainly a proponent of his own ideologies and wrote a lot of things to match his own personal vision.

http://english.pravda.ru/world/europ...83892-hitler-0

[tame_deuces]

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If this is the truth then how do you explain Lenin's, Stalin's, Pol Pot's and Mao Tse Tung's policies?


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These people are on the top of your head the 4 individuals you immediately think of when you utter the word 'logical reasoning'?

[Splendour]

Of course not tame_deuces...I doubt they are on the top of anyone's logician list...I do take exception to atheists claiming moral superiority over religious people though...Atheists have no monopoly on logic...and inhumane personal logic is no better than misapplied religious beliefs as I think recent political history shows...

[vhawk01]

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The simple truth is that people who are willing to denounce logical reasoning in favor of faith are more likely to accept genocide than people who are skeptical of religion.

If this is the truth then how do you explain Lenin's, Stalin's, Pol Pot's and Mao Tse Tung's policies?

It seems that atheism comes in as many variants as does religion (from a thinking Catholic's perspective):

http://www.carl-olson.com/articles/atheism_envoy.html

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They all denounced logical reasoning in favor of faith. Stalin is just about a perfect example of this.

[RustedCorpse]

Disclaimer: My personal bias is that Hitler wasn’t an atheist, as I explain below.

One of the reasons this argument is so important is because it once again shows a pick and choose mentality for theists. Redundant logic of “Hitler couldn’t be Christian because he did all those horrible acts, therefore he’s an atheist” shows the ability of Theists to detach themselves from anyone with a bad reputation. There is no “member card” for faith, so they can pick and choose after the fact.

Hitler believed in the supernatural, this is a pretty solid statement, which implies that he wasn’t an atheist. And while it shouldn’t be damning of Christianity directly, it should be noted as a severe disillusionment with reality. I’m sorry but if there is someone leading a nation that believes in the equivalent of “magic” a constituent should be able to point and say “There is no evidence to support your claims… “And Hitler provides a perfect example of what happens when you don’t question dogma.

Why does it get brought up? Because theists love to use some of his atheist remarks as testimonies to what happens “without a moral compass”. Atheist tend to look at his Christian statements and say “Dogma= obedience=malleability”


The moral of the story is that [censored] up people do [censored] up [censored]. The problem being that people who subscribe to dogmas are more likely to be manipulated. A group mentality is common in humans; we want safety in numbers, so if we’re not critical of any establishment we risk blind obedience.

[SNOWBALL]

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The focus should be on WHY he did what he did.

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I couldn't give 2 [censored] about why he did what he did. There will always be people like hitler. The critical thing is having a poltical environment where people are fearful, angry, obedient, confused, etc. etc.

[tpir]

Well, it doesn't LDO. Problem is, the people who trot this out as an argument for/against whatever are not smart enough to realize why it's a bad argument in the first place. So reasonable people have to keep hearing it all the time, that is the only reason I can see why it "matters".

[ZeeJustin]

A) Hitler was probably the second most important/influential human being to ever exist (behind Jesus), so everything about his life is pretty damn important. We have so much that we can still learn from this man (almost entirely from using him as a bad example of course).

B) God was crucial to his plan. There is no way he could have gotten all of Germany (and more) on his side without being able to say that Aryans were chosen by God. The idea of God was a crucial piece in the puzzle that led to 50 million deaths.

[WiiiiiiMan]

So Zee, your point being that God is a negative on the world?

Plus I'd question you on that 50 Million number. Think more like 11 to 12 million at most. But who gives a [censored] about 30 to 35 Million people right. Let's just make up big sexy numbers.

But I do know that Joseph Stalin and Mao Zedong who were atheist in the same century as Hitler did kill over 100 Million people together.

So I have 2, you have 1. God was no where near those guys minds, and oh over 100 million people killed.

Plus, I don't buy into the God was a crucial piece of the puzzle cause a fanatic person will put that kind of emotion in anything.

Know your facts and quit making up stuff to fit your warped ideology.

Nations have been formed in that type of cause and God was no where near it. I know you want it to be so bad cause it would be so sweet for you, but you can't just make up things and have them be true. Believe or not, just cause you think something, doesn't mean it's true. Ah, what a concept. But if you want to be ignorant, whatever.

I'd love to get a list of the books you've fed urself in ur young naive life.

I like facts, how bout you?

Be careful what you read sir.

[kurto]

I'd like to comment...

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So Zee, your point being that God is a negative on the world?


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I don't believe he said that at all. I think he merely answered the question posed by the OP.

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Plus I'd question you on that 50 Million number. Think more like 11 to 12 million at most. But who gives a [censored] about 30 to 35 Million people right. Let's just make up big sexy numbers.

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11 million or 50 million... does it really make a big difference?

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But I do know that Joseph Stalin and Mao Zedong who were atheist in the same century as Hitler did kill over 100 Million people together.


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You are missing the key distinction. Zee was saying Hitler accomplished what he did THROUGH religious beliefs. They were a factor in his plan/success and possibly his beliefs.

Your examples weren't motivated by the fact that they were atheists. Atheism has NOTHING to do with what they did. You might as well point out that they both had dark hair.

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Plus, I don't buy into the God was a crucial piece of the puzzle cause a fanatic person will put that kind of emotion in anything.


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Whether you buy it or not has little to do with what happened. Hitler used religion in his plans. You may question if he was sincere or not... but there's no doubt that he used religion in his speech and imagery to command his nation.

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Know your facts and quit making up stuff to fit your warped ideology.


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I suggest you are defending your ideology here... so much so that you're putting words into zee's mouth.

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Nations have been formed in that type of cause and God was no where near it. I know you want it to be so bad cause it would be so sweet for you, but you can't just make up things and have them be true. Believe or not, just cause you think something, doesn't mean it's true. Ah, what a concept. But if you want to be ignorant, whatever.

I'd love to get a list of the books you've fed urself in ur young naive life.

I like facts, how bout you?

Be careful what you read sir.

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Now you're just ranting and making a lot of generalizations and vague insults to a person you do not know. It suggests you're having an emotional reaction to his post rathar then merely considering its content.