Hand I observed - Page 2

Heisenb3rg · #11 10-15-2007, 04:23 PM

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I also don't think preflop should be standard. Against some of the players with tighter steal ranges I think its better to fold this preflop.

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I disagree with 100% of this content matters.

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surfdoc · #12 10-15-2007, 05:00 PM

danza, I am curious as to why it blows your mind. There are several reasonable ways to play this and this is one of them. Maybe not the best way, but a reasonable way.

danzasmack · #13 10-15-2007, 05:10 PM

oh i just wanted people to type "blows your mind" a bunch of times so whatevs on that.

No but seriously i saw the hand go down, thought nothing of it, then realized how bad the flop line is given pf. You're basically never going to play the hand well this way. So then you talk about the value of a hand in position vs. OOP, but then you think of how this hand works in position.

Then i thought of how i play a hand like 89 or A5 here and how much money i'm probably losing OOP in this spot.

Then i realized that we win this pot a lot easier if we 3-bet pf, and we win a lot of other times when we have no shot of winning vs. a wide 3-betting range, and if we consider the % of time we c/r a flop in a blind battle why don't i just 3-bet pf here? Like bringing the very bottom and very top of your range together here and playing the middle the same.

This is just one of those spots that i never really asked about. I just let the cards come, c/r decent flops, c/r broadway ones, i got better @ poker when i started playing well on boards where i flop 2nd/3rd pair and then just moved on.

HOWMANY · #14 10-15-2007, 05:25 PM

The really weird thing is that it has honestly never crossed my mind to 3bet preflop here but I would 3bet this some amount of the time from the bb in a HU game. I think you just blew my mind as well.

danzasmack · #15 10-15-2007, 05:27 PM

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The really weird thing is that it has honestly never crossed my mind to 3bet preflop here but I would 3bet this some amount of the time from the bb in a HU game. I think you just blew my mind as well.

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internet hi five

god i love making the games bad for me

danzasmack · #16 10-15-2007, 05:30 PM

clearly the huge difference is that OTB HUHU a guys range is usually much greater than a steal situation in 6max but yeah

vmacosta · #17 10-15-2007, 09:28 PM

sorry for being stubborn, but i still don't see what's wrong with this hand.

We can't be 3-betting these hands every time pf cuz then K-hi's just gonna start calling us down every time and q9o is gonna be capping.

We flopped a really low-equity draw and decided to just peel and fold. Obviously there are some merits to other lines but its hard to say that when you have 28% equity and are getting 5.5:1 that you MUST raise or fold.

Then on the turn our draw improved but the fact that villain bet again after the 3rd str8 card comes means he's much more likely to have a good pair.

On the river we miss and there's not a very good chance this guy's gonna 3-barrel with no pair when it looks very much like we have a small pair.

I didn't go through this argument cuz I'm sure I'm right, but I'm not totally satisfied with the consensus so far.

2muchneon · #18 10-16-2007, 04:57 AM

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It blows my mind that it blows your mind.

pf: no other way to play it
flop: I often c/r the flop here but it has to be marginal. there may be more to gain by calling if we often get a free river. this is the only questionable street IMO.

turn: standard as played, we're hoping for a free card and I think when we don't get it our fold eq is pretty low. but we have plenty of outs to continue.

river: we lose

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If you check the river and he checks behind, you don't have any more decision to make... but what do you think he might have if he bets the river?