DEEPSTACKED with nuts Theory Question

[blah_blah]

it seems like one of these hands should have the Ah in it.

anyways even though hand 2 probably has the best equity against a reasonable range for BB here, it seems like hands 4/5 probably have the best implied odds in the sense that BB is likely to blast away on offsuit Q,K, and As, so I'd think that you'd prefer to just call here even though I think you will win bigger pots with 4/5 than 2 most of the time.

e: I guess if he has KQ and you do as well there are only 4 Qs and Ks left in the deck; I'm kind of stupid like that.

[pete fabrizio]

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I call with all those hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

[DonCologne]

Remember even with a nutflush redraw + redraw to a higher straight you are a dog against somebodys nutstraight and a flopped set. So if the money is such deep, it is even with the nutflushdraw not an no brainer all in on the flop.

board: 9hThJs
Hand Pot equity Wins Ties
QcKcAh3h 47.13% 256 261
QsKhJcJd 52.87% 303 261

[blah_blah]

there are a lot of silly situations you can draw up like this

http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3281575
pokenum -o qs ks ah jh - jc jd kc qd - -- 9h th js
Omaha Hi: 820 enumerated boards containing Js Th 9h
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
Ks Qs Ah Jh 323 39.39 265 32.32 232 28.29 0.535
Kc Jc Qd Jd 265 32.32 323 39.39 232 28.29 0.465

500BB deep nut straight + nut flush redraw + nut straight redraw is definitely a 'no brainer' all in

[pete fabrizio]

[ QUOTE ]
Remember even with a nutflush redraw + redraw to a higher straight you are a dog against somebodys nutstraight and a flopped set. So if the money is such deep, it is even with the nutflushdraw not an no brainer all in on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

You seem to think this second sentence follows logically from the first, when it clearly doesn't.

[DonCologne]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Remember even with a nutflush redraw + redraw to a higher straight you are a dog against somebodys nutstraight and a flopped set. So if the money is such deep, it is even with the nutflushdraw not an no brainer all in on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

You seem to think this second sentence follows logically from the first, when it clearly doesn't.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol. Take a encyclopedia show what is standing under irony and maye you understand my posting.
If not I give you a tip: Many person here sees only the 1% worst case szenario you can get against. So if this not enough maybe you can come to an other conclusion if the money is deeper (500 BB). What is if both habe 5000 or 50000 BB? That is not the reality.
The point is, under normal conditions you are 50 or lets say 100BB maybe 200BB deep, you will find enough idiots pushing with a bare straight draw and so it is against most opponents +EV to pushing every flopped nutstraight with a little bit of redraw and for sure the nutflush redraw.

[Silent A]

The whole point of this thread is to outline the differences between normal and deep-stacked play. There are hands that should be felted for 100 BBs but not 500BBs.

Now, we all know that in general this is true, but actually figuring out where the line is crossed is important. Especially when you realize that a number of people derive a very large fraction of their long term win rate from deep-stacked scenarios.

[iggymcfly]

Yeah, I also call with all of these. Unless you have a really good redraw where you're gleeful to get it in against another KQ, you're usually better off letting your opponent fire away for another street just to get more value from a lower straight and to force him to define his hand a little more.