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#11
01-13-2006, 04:03 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
Ugh.
I call the turn here at least. you're getting 7.5-1 immediatly and are about 8-1 against AA/KK/QQ. Of course then you probably have to call the river too. This is how i talk myself into calling down. I think it's ok, let me know. 
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#14
01-13-2006, 07:40 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
[ QUOTE ]
How come you didn't bet the flop, hoping BB would raise with TT,99,A7,A8 or OC to protect your hand on this sort of dangerous flop? [/ QUOTE ] When I saw the flop, I figured I probably had the best hand. And also figured I could count on BB to auto-bet the flop, in this 3-way pot. I wasn't sure, however, that he would auto-raise. So if I led the flop and got raised, my chances of being best just went down, whereas I could get in a checkraise as a clear favorite. And if Button doesn't have the odds to call two cold, then he doesn't have the odds to call two bets one at a time, either. The line I took doesn't improve my chances of winning the hand that much, but it is a way to try to get value out of it. As it turned out, BB 3-bet the checkraise and this did drive out Button. So I got my protection after all. Unfortunately, at the table, I decided this 3-bet meant I was in trouble. And it's entirely possible I was, but BB could have a hand like the vulnerable ones you mention (TT, 99, A8, A7) instead of the the bigger jacks and overpairs I was worried about. I think I should have seen a showdown.
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#15
01-13-2006, 07:44 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
the flop check raise is perfect. sometimes you just have to realize that the villain will 3-bet with enough crap that you have bloated the pot enough to force yourself to go to showdown. this looks like one of those spots.
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#17
01-13-2006, 07:45 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
[ QUOTE ]
whereas I could get in a checkraise as a clear favorite. [/ QUOTE ] How do you figure this? BB didn't miss a raise yet, so checking to him on the flop and seeing him bet shouldn't strengthen your guess of being best. Betting into BB and seeing him raise might make you slow down a tad and get to showdown cheaper (if you don't improve further). I think this is the perfect opportunity to lead the flop. Edit: I see the merits of the flop check raise here too, and in no way do I think it's bad, but I don't include it as an auto-move with a vulnerable top pair. Heck, maybe it's better to check raise here, but I still like the flop lead.
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#18
01-13-2006, 07:50 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
[ QUOTE ]
at least consider capping flop or c/raising or donking turn. [/ QUOTE ] I think both of these are overplaying. Just call down after the flop 3bet.
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#19
01-13-2006, 07:56 PM
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Re: JTs -- I fall back on an old full-ring line
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] whereas I could get in a checkraise as a clear favorite. [/ QUOTE ] How do you figure this? BB didn't miss a raise yet, so checking to him on the flop and seeing him bet shouldn't strengthen your guess of being best. [/ QUOTE ] You're right that his bet does not strengthen my chances of being best. I don't think it does anything to indicate my hand isn't best either, though. Basically, my assumption was that BB would auto-bet. So to me his bet meant he still had the same two cards he did preflop, whatever those were. I would auto-bet is his spot too, figuring my A9s or whatnot might in fact be best. So I'm not criticizing his bet or anything. But I did think checkraising was the best way to exploit it. If I knew Villain would auto-raise the flop, then I would have led into him, planning to 3-bet.
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