Dennis Kucinich

[MrMon]

[ QUOTE ]
US has for profit healthcare and it costs us 7k per person.

In other industrialized nations with not for profit healthcare they pay 3k per person.

Vegan, the other posters in this thread are trolling because they have a very narrow worldview. You can see the problems DK causes based on the very childish responses you've elicted.

The media doesn't like dennis, and thats reason enough for me to have voted for him in the last primary.

At what cost, Nelblis? 400 billion in administration and profits to the healthcare industry that he would wipe out.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure where you get the $400 billion in profit and administrative costs, but let's accept it at face value. (Upon further review, it's at least in the ballpark, so no arguing with it.) Total US spending on health care is on the order of $2 trillion. So the $400 billion represents 20%, which means that if you could eliminate it, you should be able to deliver the same health care for $5400 per capita. But this is still WAY more than the $3000 other industrialized nations pay. Why is that? If your target is to pay what other countries do, how are you going to get there?

To make things more difficult, realize that you can't eliminate administrative costs completely, even Medicare has administrative costs, somewhere around 5.2% if figured accurately. So let's add $300 back on top, to get to $5700. You've still got to cut $2700 to get to the world figure. That's nearly 50%, how are you going to do it?

Note: I know my math is technically not correct, but it's close enough to show the magnitude of the problem. Correcting the math isn't going to change the figure signifigantly.

[NeBlis]

[ QUOTE ]
He talking about trimming the corporate fat.

Calling hilary and edwards amoral scum is trolling, am i right, Iron?

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose i will defer to Iron on that.

but troll or no troll.

IMO "A win at all costs" candidate who will say anything for a vote is amoral scum, and Hillary and Edwards are that type of candidate.

now lets get this thread back on Kucinich rather than his less upstanding party mates

[QuadsOverQuads]

[ QUOTE ]
He's for:
1. Socialized healthcare.
2. Federally socialized education.
3. Pulling out of the WTO and NAFTA for the wrong reasons - He's a protectionist which will *hurt* the US economy, not help it.
4. He thinks: "we can create millions of jobs and simultaneously improve our quality of life"
Newsflash: Government doesn't create [censored]. This way of "creating" jobs results in higher prices for the goods / services that those jobs create.
5. Full social security at age 65. Great, more theft, perverse incentives and bureaucracy - Washington was totally lacking those things.

Wow, he thinks that:
"People have a right to:

* Have a job.
* Have a safe workplace.
* Get decent wages and benefits.
* Organize and be represented.
* Grieve about working conditions.
* Strike.
* Get fair compensation for injuries on the job.
* Sue if injured by negligent employers.
* Have secure pension and retirement benefits.
* Participate in the political process."



[/ QUOTE ]

That's an excellent start. I look forward to hearing more.


q/q

[kyleb]

[ QUOTE ]
How can you not love this guy?

[/ QUOTE ]

Because he's an idiot.

[PokrLikeItsProse]

I will forever picture Dennis Kucinich as portrayed by Amy Poehler on SNL partaking in the fringe candidates debate.

[The.Accountant]

I like him and think that he's probably the candidate most in line with my personal views, and yet he is a loser who will never win, which is why I support Al Gore. holla.

[whiskeytown]

Dennis Kucinich reminds me of Yoda. (with Cheney as Palpatine, of course) -

Dennis has lots of heart - you want him on your side, but I don't think his views jibe with a majority of Americans or even Democrats. The Democratic candidate needs more dark side.

I think he should spend more time at home with the lovely wife, IMHO - if I was married to her I'd never go to work/leave the house again [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

rb

[Ron Burgundy]

Ron Paul said that if he had to vote for a dem, he would vote for Kucinich.

[Nielsio]

[ QUOTE ]
<font color="purple">What's wrong with not for profit health care? </font>

[/ QUOTE ]


The problem is that it disallows competition and choice. The other problem is that it's an economic nightmare. Every single incentive for providing a good service or product is screwed up.


Cuba has such a system. Russia had such a system. North Korea has such a system.

What they would do in Russia is that they would centrally plan less deaths and order this to their hospitals. The result was that the hospitals would not accept people with serious health problems and/or they would shove people with serious conditions onto the streets. Thus the statistic of 'deaths in hospitals' was improved.


Maybe instead of restricting freedom in healthcare, you should consider increasing freedom in healthcare. It's the restriction of freedom that has caused the problems that exist. There is massive restriction currently, and the trend has been an ever increasing buildup of govt involvement in the past 40 years. The results are telling of this govt involvement.

[ojc02]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
He's for:
1. Socialized healthcare.
2. Federally socialized education.
3. Pulling out of the WTO and NAFTA for the wrong reasons - He's a protectionist which will *hurt* the US economy, not help it.
4. He thinks: "we can create millions of jobs and simultaneously improve our quality of life"
Newsflash: Government doesn't create [censored]. This way of "creating" jobs results in higher prices for the goods / services that those jobs create.
5. Full social security at age 65. Great, more theft, perverse incentives and bureaucracy - Washington was totally lacking those things.

Wow, he thinks that:
"People have a right to:

* Have a job.
* Have a safe workplace.
* Get decent wages and benefits.
* Organize and be represented.
* Grieve about working conditions.
* Strike.
* Get fair compensation for injuries on the job.
* Sue if injured by negligent employers.
* Have secure pension and retirement benefits.
* Participate in the political process."



[/ QUOTE ]

That's an excellent start. I look forward to hearing more.


q/q

[/ QUOTE ]

Rights have to be enforced at the point of a gun. Enforcing the right to not be killed at the point of my gun is something I have no problem with. The right to have a job?? If it were a voluntary agreement you'd have the job already without government. So you want to force two parties to associate at the point of a gun?

Meh, you're probably fine with that. I think it's appalling.