Oh My God... what's worse then Razz? no content

[kurto]

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I don't see why you can't understand that this can be very irritating.

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Because its only irritating for those who dont know how to play the game correctly, otherwise 90% of all fields - even the WSOP is as soft as a baby's bottom.

TT [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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I want to start by saying saying this is the goofiest debate I've had on 2+2. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

I can know how to play a game and still find it irritating. I think to run bad at a draw game is, personally, more irritating then other forms of poker.

Let's take an example using Stud 8.

I'm dealt A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

4 people limp in before me and I raise it up. Everyone calls.

I draw 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img])

Now I'm ramming and jamming. Getting called by people with all sorts of crap showing.

My next card is a 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] - I've still got 9 flush outs, 3 additional straight outs with nut low and 9 additional low outs... The only correct way to play this is to continue to bet.

6th street is a J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] -- Perhaps now you are reduced to check calling. There's certainly no way you're folding.

7th street... 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].... so your final hand is 4s over 2s.

My point is that ONLY in a game like this can you watch yourself miss 20+ outs against completely donkish calling stations for 4 streets.

At the 27 table, there was one player who played about 95% of all hands (and most were raised by others at the start) He would call two bets cold and then draw 4. The person was a mild winner. You see the 'schooling' effect much more in these limit games.

[*TT*]

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Because its only irritating for those who dont know how to play the game correctly

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I think it's more a matter of having the proper attitude than playing well.

Getting the proper attitude will help you no end in high poker.

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Amen - but you do need both unfortunately [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[bugstud]

you've never shoved with KdQd in holdem against 4c3c on a JdTd3h flop and missed?

[kurto]

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you've never shoved with KdQd in holdem against 4c3c on a JdTd3h flop and missed?

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Of course. The holdem hand... over in 15 seconds.

Same situation in holdem... 2 minutes for each street requires action. My point isn't simply the bad luck. Its that you have to watch your bad luck unfold slowly over multiple streets. At each street you get to watch the massive underdog call bets while grossly behind (but slowly improve) and you get to watch yourself brick-- brick--- brick (for stud games there can 4 opportunities to brick)

[flafishy]

I know what you're saying, kurto. I find this with 7 Stud/8. It's like Chinese water torture when you start out with a great low draw and then hit brick after brick while the donkeys are catching their 9955s and stuff like that. It makes me nuts, and has me convinced that with the rake and the frequent split pots, that's not a game that's beatable at the low stakes.

[mosta]

is this thread about razz, or 2-7??

[kurto]

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is this thread about razz, or 2-7??

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Kind of about both. Its just me bitching about how these games (when you're running bad) are, as Flafish said, like chinese water torture.