(NLTRN) heads up roi

[cwar]

I dunno its hard for me to say, Ive run really bad at the 55s so I dont want to give a skewed opinion. 55 players definitely dont put their money in with dominated hands as often as 33 players though.

[SorryKid]

I went into excel and made a list of winnin % from 1 to 100 based on 1000 tournaments. I put an ROI box next to each winning % with the ROI formula (profit / games played / buyin per tourney)

I learned that in HU tournaments, there is a direct relationship between your winning % and your ROI. This is of course assuming that you are paying a fee that is equvilant of 2.5% of the buy in.

This should hold true for all levels of buy ins in HU tournaments. Am I correct in saying this?

[Crispy Bacon]

Far more important than ROI is winrate. If you have a 50% ROI in a 45 player Sng and a 10% ROI in HU, you making way more in HU because you've played about 8 matches in the time it's taken you to play one 45 SnG

[cwar]

Turbo's dont have 2.5% rake.

[SorryKid]

I am aware that ROI is far more important than win rate, but in HU tournaments these two numbers go hand in hand. If you win 50% of your HU tournamens, your ROI is going to be about -4% (cost of the rake).

If your win rate is 60% your ROI is going to be about 15.20%.

*(Note - these numbers only have a relationship when talking about HU tournaments.)

When I said that there was a 2.5% fee, I was referring to HU tournaments, NOT cash games.

Poker Stars HU turbo tournaments:
6 + .25 in rake - .25 / 12 (prize pool) = 2.0833%
11 + .50 in rake - .50 / 22 (prize pool) = 2.2727%
22 + 1 in rake - 1 / 44 (prize pool) = 2.2727%
220 + 10 in rake - 10 / 440 (prize pool) = 2.2727%

- From these numbers you can see there is a fee of about 2.25% of the prize pool for the turbo head's up tournaments on Poker Stats. (I am not aware what the fee is on other websites, however if someone would like to post this information that would be greatly appreciated.)

* Important to note that the turbo HU tournaments have a slightly lower fee than the regular speed tournaments.

[ChicagoRy]

I think the way to look at it is to look at your buyin versus your rake.

And you mixed up your first sentence.

I don't understand what this thread is trying to accomplish after the first few posts.

[SorryKid]

Yes I apologize for the mistakes and for the thread getting a bit off topic.

[Crispy Bacon]

Ok I have a hypohetical question I have been pondering a while which I wonder if anyone is able to answer.

Say you have a MTT , HU SNG and a NL cash player who are in the top 5% of their buy-in level. I know we can't equate the buy-in of the cash game player withe tourney players but lets just say it's similar.

Now we make these player play an infinite number of games. Who is winning more $ on an hourly basis and roughly how much more than the others?

[ChicagoRy]

We'd need some info like how long the average game is lasting for these players. Also what ROI you have to have to be in the top 5% of all players at each level. Maybe Nicho's database could help us solve 1/3 of this particular problem.

Aside from that, all that this would take is an equation. Plug in the numbers for single tabling and see what happens.

[SorryKid]

Without doing calculations, I can tell you what I've read and have heard.

The top 5% of NL cash players supposedly make a lot more than the top 5% of MTT players.

This is what I've read on some different forums.