Meh spot

[grafyx]

[ QUOTE ]

1. Your stack size really makes this a trouble hand, because ideally you would like to call here and bet out about 2000-2400 on a flop with J high or under. But, doing so would leave you with a less than desirable chip stack, but still playable, if he comes over you on the flop.


[/ QUOTE ]

I hate this. Why do you think this is a good line against UTGs range? We are potentially going to invest 3200 of our remaining 6200 and then fold?

If this is a profitable with 9s, its a profitable line with ATC.

[Potowame]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

1. Your stack size really makes this a trouble hand, because ideally you would like to call here and bet out about 2000-2400 on a flop with J high or under. But, doing so would leave you with a less than desirable chip stack, but still playable, if he comes over you on the flop.


[/ QUOTE ]

I hate this. Why do you think this is a good line against UTGs range? We are potentially going to invest 3200 of our remaining 6200 and then fold?

If this is a profitable with 9s, its a profitable line with ATC.

[/ QUOTE ]


The Stack size is why It makes it a bad or a trouble hand to play it this way. But if You had Equal stacks I would take this line. I hate this line myself in this situation as I pointed out, but I really don't care for a push here either. I would rather probly just let it go.

[NoahSD]

It sounds like the read makes it a fold. It's close, though. I think TT's pretty clear shove and 88 is a pretty clear fold.

[Che]

[ QUOTE ]
sorry if this is too brief, but i have no problem with a shove

his range is going to be, at its tightest, 66+/AQ/KQ, with a calling range of 88+/AK, again at its tightest.

with the antes i'm fairly certain this is +EV

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with evg. Shoving is slightly +EV at worst, possibly very +EV. Therefore, folding and the associated 0 EV is clearly out unless some weird table dynamic is going on that you haven't told us about. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

Calling and playing a flop only makes sense if we believe villain we will frequently make an error when we push the flop.

EITHER

[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Calling when behind (e.g. AK on 752 flop)
[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Folding when ahead (e.g. QT on AT7 or even J9 on J33)

OR

If villain's postflop play will allow us to play perfectly. The most common example of this is a villain who will check behind when he hits while pushing when he whiffs. In this case, you would check any flop (obviously [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img]).

Given your read on opponent, these errors seem unlikely so pushing is probably best.

Very nice hand,
Che

[SossMan]

[ QUOTE ]
I think it was Sossman (wheres he at anyways) that said never push 99 over a (normal) UTG Raiser.


[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think I've ever said 'never' do anything.

That being said, I think this is one of those grumbling folds. I can't imagine jamming is very bad from an EV perspective. I would want a better read and more control over my opponent to call and play a flop (not to say that I never would).

There's my MTT post for the year.

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
And I am not giving you a reason because I am not your monkey.

[/ QUOTE ]

Damn you!

Be my monkey!

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
If you had 52s, I'd call and flop the wheel + FD.

[/ QUOTE ]

I need to be on the button and raising over you and Mr. Tim Caum for this amazingly profitable move to work.

My hand isn't nearly as strong here as it was there....

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
There's my MTT post for the year.

[/ QUOTE ]

I feel honored sir.

Hope you are finding time to play.

Regards,
Woodguy

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]

1. Your stack size really makes this a trouble hand, because ideally you would like to call here and bet out about 2000-2400 on a flop with J high or under. But, doing so would leave you with a less than desirable chip stack, but still playable, if he comes over you on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Bleh. If you call I think your options are check raising all in or check folding. Leading is a spew, although I'm not convinced calling PF is a spew, but it might me.

[woodguy]

[ QUOTE ]
I think my plan would be stop and go here. Once the flop comes, you will have the FE that you sorely need and you might get him to lay down a better hand on the right flops, not allowing him to see all 5 cards (which is pretty much the principal of the stop and go as far as I understand).

[/ QUOTE ]

My hand is too strong to SnG and I usually end up making UTG play perfect. fnurt has a great thread recently about that exactly, its worth a read.

Also, the stack sizes are all wrong for an SnG