Ok Boys n Girls, what do I do now?

[bennyhana]

easiest check raise evar

give me a T!
give me a R!
give me a A!
give me a P!

[Buzz-cp]

I donk. Now this IS an example where we'd like an overpair to raise and protect our hand.

[MrWookie]

Let me ask you guys this. Let's assume that SB has some manner of gutshot and that UTG has AA. UTG will bet 100% if we go for a c/r, and SB will happily call 1 small bet twice with his gutshot. Alternatively, UTG will raise 100% if we donk, and SB will quickly fold w/o proper odds for two bets cold. Which line results in the greatest EV? Break out poker stove and show me some equity.

Once we finish that, then we can look at some other hands in UTG's range.

[jeanbaptiste36]

I'm leaning towards the check-raise too. There is no guarantee he will raise but a much greater likelihood that he will bet.

[Zeldark]

The value of a C/R will change significantly depending on if UTG bets it or the CO does.

If UTG will likely not C-bet I bet the flop.
If UTG will likely C-bet I C/R the flop and trap the field.
If UTG will likely C-bet flop and turn I C/R the field on the turn.
This hand is beautiful.

[Shillx]

Betting saves you the pot about 7% of the time (so about .7 SB) when he folds the turn.

If he is committed to seeing a river then knocking him out will net you 14 SB about 75% of the time and cost you 4 SB 25% of the time. So that comes out to about +9.5 SB/trial. You will win 18 SB if you decide to trap him but you will only win 60% of the time (+9.2 SB/trial). There are other considerations but it is close.

[Thomas Newton]

I'm barely pokerstove literate so...

Here's one possible scenario.

324,685,269 games 268.922 secs 1,207,358 games/sec

Board: 9d 6s Qh
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 57.810% 57.81% 00.00% 187701396 0.00 { Qc9c }
Hand 1: 22.591% 22.59% 00.00% 73350220 0.00 { AhAs }
Hand 2: 19.599% 19.60% 00.00% 63633653 0.00 { KcTh }

[bravos1]

[ QUOTE ]
easiest check raise evar

give me a T!
give me a R!
give me a A!
give me a P!

[/ QUOTE ]

[Christian_Peters]

[ QUOTE ]
The value of a C/R will change significantly depending on if UTG bets it or the CO does.

If UTG will likely not C-bet I bet the flop.
If UTG will likely C-bet I C/R the flop and trap the field.
If UTG will likely C-bet flop and turn I C/R the field on the turn.
This hand is beautiful.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm glad the hand is generating some discussion.

I actually did have an uber-trap in mind for this hand,i.e. c/r turn; but I quickly decided against that sort of play because a very sizeable portion of turn cards will:
a) force me to play more cautiously
b) will force others to play more cautiously

I'm not sure I've ever actually c/c the flop w/ 2 pair to set up a turn c/r against a PFR and a field of more than 3 villians.

[Buzz-cp]

[ QUOTE ]
Let me ask you guys this. Let's assume that SB has some manner of gutshot and that UTG has AA. UTG will bet 100% if we go for a c/r, and SB will happily call 1 small bet twice with his gutshot. Alternatively, UTG will raise 100% if we donk, and SB will quickly fold w/o proper odds for two bets cold. Which line results in the greatest EV? Break out poker stove and show me some equity.


[/ QUOTE ]

hmm like this?

----
Board: 6s 9d Qh


With SB: .6*(4SB)-.4*(2SB) = 1.6SB
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 59.579% 59.58% 00.00% 538 0.00 { Qc9c }
Hand 1: 17.829% 17.83% 00.00% 161 0.00 { KcJh }
Hand 2: 22.591% 22.59% 00.00% 204 0.00 { AdAh }

Without SB: .75*2SB-.25(2SB) = 1SB
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 74.545% 74.55% 00.00% 738 0.00 { Qc9c }
Hand 1: 25.455% 25.45% 00.00% 252 0.00 { AdAh }
----

only thing is we are dealing with 4 villains, not 2.