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#11
06-17-2007, 09:19 AM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] What are the ChiComs going to do with the dollars if they don't roll their position? [/ QUOTE ] Maybe buy up US assets such as property, stocks, commodities? I doubt they'd want to invest those devalued $ in another country with a disadvantage in exchange rates. [/ QUOTE ] A couple decades ago people worried about the Japanese doing the same thing. They were buying like crazy in Hawaii and Cali. They owned Rockefeller Center in New York. They sent art prices through the roof. Do you recall how all that worked out for them? [ QUOTE ] As for "ChiComms" I don't believe the Chinese are really true communists. Their economy is less regulated and less taxed than The US' economy. [/ QUOTE ] Whether or not they are "true" communists is irrelevant. There are still severe limitations on civil liberties in China. 
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#12
06-17-2007, 09:58 AM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] What are the ChiComs going to do with the dollars if they don't roll their position? [/ QUOTE ] Maybe buy up US assets such as property, stocks, commodities? I doubt they'd want to invest those devalued $ in another country with a disadvantage in exchange rates. [/ QUOTE ] A couple decades ago people worried about the Japanese doing the same thing. They were buying like crazy in Hawaii and Cali. They owned Rockefeller Center in New York. They sent art prices through the roof. Do you recall how all that worked out for them? [ QUOTE ] As for "ChiComms" I don't believe the Chinese are really true communists. Their economy is less regulated and less taxed than The US' economy. [/ QUOTE ] Whether or not they are "true" communists is irrelevant. There are still severe limitations on civil liberties in China. [/ QUOTE ] In the US too. The USA has perhaps the most severe limitations on civil liberties amongst 'The Free World', and these liberties are being eroded daily at the expense of 'freedom'..... [ QUOTE ] The difference, of course, is that the U.S. government will never default because they can always print more money. [/ QUOTE ] And thus further devaluing the $US and make taking on further US debt by foreigners even less likely which returns to my original question.
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#13
06-17-2007, 10:57 AM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] What are the ChiComs going to do with the dollars if they don't roll their position? [/ QUOTE ] Maybe buy up US assets such as property, stocks, commodities? I doubt they'd want to invest those devalued $ in another country with a disadvantage in exchange rates. [/ QUOTE ] A couple decades ago people worried about the Japanese doing the same thing. They were buying like crazy in Hawaii and Cali. They owned Rockefeller Center in New York. They sent art prices through the roof. Do you recall how all that worked out for them? [ QUOTE ] As for "ChiComms" I don't believe the Chinese are really true communists. Their economy is less regulated and less taxed than The US' economy. [/ QUOTE ] Whether or not they are "true" communists is irrelevant. There are still severe limitations on civil liberties in China. [/ QUOTE ] In the US too. The USA has perhaps the most severe limitations on civil liberties amongst 'The Free World', and these liberties are being eroded daily at the expense of 'freedom'..... [/ QUOTE ] ok, now you are being stupid. sorry to be harsh, but did you just compare the lack of civil liberties in china, to the lack of civil liberties in the US with the implication that they are similar?? if so, i stand by my statement above. otherwise, please to note the fact that CHINESE CITIZENS CANNOT OWN STOCK anywhere else in the world. and that the press in china has CENSORSHIP (by the govt). or what about the fact that chinese banks are FORCED INTO STERILISING THE GOVT'S POLICY OF CURRENCY INTERVENTION! the citizens are paying for the govt's 1.3trillion in foreign currency reserves. if i were you i'd stop being so brash and simply restate your original quesiton...i don't even know exactly what your beef is. could you very simply in one brief sentance ask the question??? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] The difference, of course, is that the U.S. government will never default because they can always print more money. [/ QUOTE ] And thus further devaluing the $US and make taking on further US debt by foreigners even less likely which returns to my original question. [/ QUOTE ] what is your original question? Barron
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#14
06-17-2007, 01:29 PM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
I don't believe the Chinese are really true communists. Their economy is less regulated and less taxed than The US' economy. My friend moved his scooter parts business to Shanghai from the US. Not because of lower labour costs, but because of lower taxation and regualations. [/ QUOTE ] The 2007 Index of Economic Freedom has the United States ranked 4th and China ranked 119th out of 157 countries.
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#15
06-17-2007, 07:56 PM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] What are the ChiComs going to do with the dollars if they don't roll their position? [/ QUOTE ] Maybe buy up US assets such as property, stocks, commodities? I doubt they'd want to invest those devalued $ in another country with a disadvantage in exchange rates. [/ QUOTE ] A couple decades ago people worried about the Japanese doing the same thing. They were buying like crazy in Hawaii and Cali. They owned Rockefeller Center in New York. They sent art prices through the roof. Do you recall how all that worked out for them? [ QUOTE ] As for "ChiComms" I don't believe the Chinese are really true communists. Their economy is less regulated and less taxed than The US' economy. [/ QUOTE ] Whether or not they are "true" communists is irrelevant. There are still severe limitations on civil liberties in China. [/ QUOTE ] In the US too. The USA has perhaps the most severe limitations on civil liberties amongst 'The Free World', and these liberties are being eroded daily at the expense of 'freedom'..... [/ QUOTE ] ok, now you are being stupid. sorry to be harsh, but did you just compare the lack of civil liberties in china, to the lack of civil liberties in the US with the implication that they are similar?? if so, i stand by my statement above. otherwise, please to note the fact that CHINESE CITIZENS CANNOT OWN STOCK anywhere else in the world. and that the press in china has CENSORSHIP (by the govt). or what about the fact that chinese banks are FORCED INTO STERILISING THE GOVT'S POLICY OF CURRENCY INTERVENTION! the citizens are paying for the govt's 1.3trillion in foreign currency reserves. if i were you i'd stop being so brash and simply restate your original quesiton...i don't even know exactly what your beef is. could you very simply in one brief sentance ask the question??? [ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] The difference, of course, is that the U.S. government will never default because they can always print more money. [/ QUOTE ] And thus further devaluing the $US and make taking on further US debt by foreigners even less likely which returns to my original question. [/ QUOTE ] what is your original question? Barron [/ QUOTE ] I'm not sure where you live, but if you live in the US then you have a surprising amount of laws, regulations, and a culture of police and military that isn't seen in other 'modern democracies' in Europe and Oceana etc. Many of this is due to Bush's 'war on terror'. I think it was Benjamin Franklin who said something like "Those who give up their liberties for the sake of security deserve and will get neither". I've mis-quoted but this was the general feeling. I wasn't comparing China to The US. I've been to both countries several times and there's little to compare. I was just trying to question the previous poster's reference to 'Chicoms' with the subsequent reference to civil liberties. I failed to see the link and tried to point our that there are many many more regulations in the US than in China for someone in business - which is partially why US business have gone from low priced and high quality to expensive and poor quality. And this isn't due to labour costs, but capital costs and the costs of doing business associated with taxes and regulation. As for my original question - it's in my original post.
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#17
06-17-2007, 09:44 PM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] US business have gone from low priced and high quality to expensive and poor quality. [/ QUOTE ] This statement simply isn't true. [/ QUOTE ] I was refering to US manufactured goods and I stand by my statement. In the 1950/60s, in America, European goods were expensive but not necessarily of higher quality. Americans just were happy to pay a premium for luxury goods such as wines, luxury foods, and clothing/art etc. "Why is it expensive?"..."Because it's imported" During this same period Asian goods were dirt cheap in The US but you had to rush to get them home before they fell apart. The struggle Japan faced over quality and reputation back then was evident when they changed one of their main manufacturing towns name's to 'Usa' and so they could legally brand their goods "MADE IN USA". This was an excellent endorsement for the high quality and reputation of US manufacturing back in the 50s/60s. These days, Asian made goods regularly make the top of quality league tables and now it's "Why is it so cheap?"..."Because it's imported" US made goods don't have the same reputation for quality they enjoyed a generation ago, and the price of these goods has skyrocketed despite a favourable exchange rate. This isn't so much because of higher labour costs (as US politics will say), but higher taxes, regulations, and capital costs of doing business in the US (as US politics won't say). I don't have a beef with The US or anyone as Barron might have thought - I just think the wool has been pulled over US citizen's eyes for so long. The mantras "we live in a free country" and "the greatest nation on Earth" wouldn't need to be repeated daily by GWB and the media if it were obviously true. These statements were true in the past and I genuinely wish they were true now. The US and its citizens are in debt up to their eyeballs, much of it owed to Asian nations. My OP was asking who will take on more US debt should China decide to stop buying Treasuries as Alan Greenspan pondered? (and helicopters or printing presses obviously aren't the answer).
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#18
06-18-2007, 03:33 AM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
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#19
06-18-2007, 10:01 AM
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Re: You can\'t fool all the Chinese all of the time
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] [/ QUOTE ] The difference, of course, is that the U.S. government will never default because they can always print more money. [/ QUOTE ] Exactly right, we will pay them off in inflated dollars if push comes to shove.
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