Hand from Schneid's Blog

[PartyGirlUK]

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Folding is still overwhelmingly clear, no?

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Right.

[rafiki]

link to blog ?

[Yeti]

google "schneids blog"

[Lestat]

Schneid's thinking is perfectly sound and on the nth level, especially if he's playing multiple tables. And I guess if you're gonna think that well you can play 77 for 3 bets. But for most of us mortals it's a fold pre-flop.

[Lestat]

It can't be an "easy" bet for Hoss. There's not a chance Schneids folds a better hand here. He has to think Schneids is hoping they both play the board. The thing is, Schneids was right as I'm sure Hoss would've bet anything from 66 to KQs too.

[Lestat]

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Exactly, I think Hoss's play in this hand is standard. Mainly, I am just confused on the river call, it doesn't make sense to me. Isn't this a standard fold/CR situation?

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c/r would've been sweet and I wonder why Schneids didn't make it. Maybe he wanted Hoss to know what he'd call with?

[Schneids]

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I dont like the river call at all, but I think it is far from the biggest mistake made in the hand.....a 3 bettor leads the AA8 flop and you have 3 people to act behind you and you have 77, why not just ditch it then and move on to the next hand....did you really call 2.5 bets then 1 more preflop hoping 77 was the biggest pr and no A out there?

My guess is with 21 small bets out there your peeling 1 to hit the set and then your done with it and when everyone behind you folds and the turn goes check check you decide to make the thin call. The problem is there is too great a chance this is going to cost you more than 1 bet on the flop....you get lucky this time and escape with 1 bet on the flop, but with this group, I have to say way more times than not, your facing multiple flop bets....

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I'm going to respond to this part first because I think that helps set up the rest of the hand:

If no information is available, I would recommend folding preflop, and again folding on the flop, almost 100% of the time. If I saw someone else show me this hand history, I would think the hand was horribly played.

That said, the game was playing extra juiced up, with way more aggression than even typical in stars 200/400. I called preflop because of the extra likelihood I would get excess action postflop.

On the flop, I felt v v v confident that if EITHER of those guys intended on seeing the turn, they'd have bet the hand themselves (this isn't a contradictory statement to the previous sentence... in juiced up aggro games, people bet their own hands, trying to 3-bet). Since they didn't, I figured it meant it was way way way more likely than normal that they didn't intend on seeing the turn (or else they just call). So, I peeled on the flop feeling extremely confident that was the only bet I was putting in on that street (I was right). Basically yeah, after Hoss bets the flop, I'm one and done.


Then as for the rest of the hand, let me just ask everybody, specifically those who've played against Hoss too: What hands are in Hoss's hand range to bet the flop, check the turn, and then bet the river? The guy is pretty fearless, what hands are he regularly checking the turn with?

Oh, and yes I am aware I am calling for only half the pot.

[Schneids]

And also some additional meta-game:

POKERSTARS GAME #11119248152: HOLD'EM LIMIT ($200/$400) - 2007/07/24 - 22:18:58 (ET)
Table 'Zerlina II' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: nimag ($14164 in chips)
Seat 2: PokerSnoopy ($7795 in chips)
Seat 3: Bluffman86 ($14361 in chips)
Seat 4: PapaWarbucks ($17062 in chips)
Seat 5: Hoss_TBF ($10280 in chips)
Seat 6: Shankar825 ($17726 in chips)
Shankar825: posts small blind $100
nimag: posts big blind $200
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to PapaWarbucks [8d 8h]
PokerSnoopy: folds
Bluffman86: folds
PapaWarbucks: raises $200 to $400
Hoss_TBF: raises $200 to $600
Shankar825: folds
nimag: folds
PapaWarbucks: calls $200
*** FLOP *** [3h 4h 5c]
PapaWarbucks: bets $200
Hoss_TBF: raises $200 to $400
PapaWarbucks: calls $200
*** TURN *** [3h 4h 5c] [6c]
PapaWarbucks: checks
Hoss_TBF: bets $400
PapaWarbucks: calls $400
*** RIVER *** [3h 4h 5c 6c] [2h]
PapaWarbucks: checks
Hoss_TBF: bets $400
PapaWarbucks: folds
Hoss_TBF collected $3095 from pot
Hoss_TBF: doesn't show hand


I'm pretty sure hands like these will stick in his mind. I folded with the Stars clock ticking at me to make an action, and he for whatever reason typed into chat he had Ah5h. This hand was a day or two before the one in OP, so, these past type of hands also weighted into my decision to call with board.

[Schneids]

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Exactly, I think Hoss's play in this hand is standard. Mainly, I am just confused on the river call, it doesn't make sense to me. Isn't this a standard fold/CR situation?

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c/r would've been sweet and I wonder why Schneids didn't make it. Maybe he wanted Hoss to know what he'd call with?

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It took me too long (was the main reason) and I think there's some chance greater than zero that he three-bets me with board, and I also don't think he folds a better hand to my checkraise, which I could prove to be a likely true statement by digging up dozens of hand histories which verify Hoss seldom folds to me.

[PartyGirlUK]

What can he 3 bet u with when he cant rep [censored]? If he 3 bets it surely has to be a bluff, so just cap it.