donkey players

[poker_bill]

Well, here's a tip then: A big stack donkey isn't going to fold any big Ace or pocket pair preflop.

[Rek]

So are you saying this tourney has a lot of players left? If so I don't like your shove at all. You already know he calls loose and he has a larger stack. The best you can be if he calls is a coin flip. I think you need to look at your own play more than his. Seems like you were seeking him out because you viewed him as a donkey. You let it affect your play. There is a name for that - tilt.

[HeroInBlack]

Realistically, any tournament you win, you're gonna have to win a coinflip or two somewhere along the line. You lost yours this time. Get used to it.

But... you need to study hard and understand when your happy to get in a coinflip and when you should be avoiding them. Roughly, if you have 10BB or less, then flipping is not really objectionable at all. But if you're deeper, you shouldn't be anxious to get into them. (That said, don't be fearful of them either, like a lot of casual players are.)

[ QUOTE ]
other players have commented on me that i am a solid player and if i go into a hand and raise means that i have a pair or any of the top 20 hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

Also note, whoever said this about you or thinks this about you, you should raise their blinds with all kinds of crap for a while and take advantage of it. Novice players fall way too in love with preflop play and think that just because someone is solid preflop means they are a good player. Well, being solid preflop is a step in the progression of a player, but you probably have many steps to go.

[RyverRat]

I definately think the open shove with 44 with 16bb is not the best move. As mentioned you have a larger stack (bad player) ahead of you that would probably look you up with two high cards, let alone anyone else with higher PP. You are not in danger yet with 16BB I would have waited for a better opportunity.

You sound like you believe you are making the right moves. My opinion is that you should reviewing your own decisions to make sure you made the right one. If other players make bad moves and win the hand so be it but its your correct decisions that win you $ in the long run.

Also as said above you know your table image. You need to use this against the players that you know are thinking this. Im guessing the bad player you are speaking of only thinks level1 poker (his 2 cards) and not what everyone else has, therefore your image to him is irrelevant.

[czGLoRy]

when describing a hand: it should go something like this (so that players can help you).


I am playing a $26 tournament. Blinds are 200/400, and I have 6500 chips. I am dealt 44 preflop in the (whatever position) cutoff seat, and I open shove. Is this the best play?

These types of posts give everyone a lot more information to work fof of. Postflop play-- include pot size, your positon, obviously the flop cards, and everything included before.

[Sir Folds A Lot]

You can call him a donk, but in the end, I like his play better than yours. Pushing in early position with 4s? To me, pushing a competitive sized stack, especially in early position, screams, I have a pair of low pockets! I hate chancing the flop, so I don't like the call with AQ, but I stil think his call was less donkish than your push.

I must qualify this with I am a donk as well. You can catch me dumping chips on Poker Stars after 9:00 pacific.

[Lansingg]

not sure why to push with 44 with 6500 chips

[Mase31683]

With an M of 11, you shouldn't be looking to shove a small pair preflop, and this hand is a showcase of why that is. You're announcing "I have a hand", as other players have told you they now know you have either "Any PP" or a "Top 20 hand" (assuming you mean big cards like AK etc).

Open shoving here, really does scream go away, you wouldn't be doing this with a premium pocket pair generally, and I don't see someone usually playing like this with a hand like AK either.

The hands that are likely to call you either have you crushed, bigger PP's 80% favorite, or are juuuuust behind, the 45/55 coinflip scenario you ended up with.

This play leaves 2 viable outcomes:
1) Everyone folds, you take down the pot and congratulate yourself for winning with the best hand

2) Someone calls and you sweat it out praying for a 4, or praying to hold up against overcards.

Don't be afraid of postflop play. This shoving seems to occur often with players who are not comfortable with their postflop skills, and are weary of small pp's. In fact, I wouldn't criticize you for folding this 44 here. You're in early position, the whole table is left to act, and with and M of 11, do you really want to commit yourself to a pair of 4's. Generally I would not. Hope this helps.