Value bet or not? - Page 2

joker122 · #11 10-19-2007, 09:05 PM

hand 1 there is no reason to check the river...i mean seriously why would you.

hand 2 i dont know villian but when he c/c two streets his range is pretty heavily weighted towards a T or a five, probably more so towards a T so i'd check.

joker122 · #12 10-19-2007, 09:07 PM

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I don't raise the turn in hand 1. As played I bet both of these rivers, but its somewhat thin...

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if you dont raise the turn because you dont think you are winning that often then why would you value bet the river?

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the fact that he bet the turn but checked the river probably has something to do with this.

Victor · #13 10-20-2007, 01:09 AM

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Hand 2 looks like an easy bet and hand 1 looks like an easy don't raise the turn because I think he should 3bet you with anything he c/r the flop with.

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and since he didnt 3bet turn that makes river super easy valuebet.

admiralfluff · #14 10-20-2007, 01:36 AM

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Hand 2 looks like an easy bet and hand 1 looks like an easy don't raise the turn because I think he should 3bet you with anything he c/r the flop with.

[/ QUOTE ] and since he didnt 3bet turn that makes river super easy valuebet.

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?? I don't know what you guys are talking about here. Why should villain be 3betting this turn at all often? This guy is a fairly solid lagtag, so his flop c/r range should be pretty wide. We should usually have a Q with this line. The times we don't, we'll have a monster or AA/KK, or will be folding to a 3bet. So he should not be 3betting 66 or or 4x, 5x, 7x. He should just call them down.

Given the play, I don't see why the VB is good. Hands he calls with are overpairs, and any 4,5, or 7. Why are we ahead of this range?

I'm either 3betting the flop, or calling down the c/r (bet when checked to), depending on more specific reads.

joker122 · #15 10-20-2007, 01:45 AM

wow i did not see that you raised the turn in hand 1.

joker122 · #16 10-20-2007, 02:04 AM

yeah now that i stove it, it def. seems like a check:

obv. i tried to make his range up with hands he could play this way until this point:

Board: 4c 5s 7d Qh Qs
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 44.860% 43.93% 00.93% 47 1.00 { Kc5c }
Hand 1: 55.140% 54.21% 00.93% 58 1.00 { 66, A7s-A4s, K7s-K4s, T7s, 97s, 87s, 85s, 76s, 64s, 65s, A7o-A4o, 87o, 76o, 65o }

assuming he calls with every hand that makes it to the river (which is not the case) you are still putting a bet in with the worst hand on average.

Victor · #17 10-20-2007, 02:26 AM

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Hand 2 looks like an easy bet and hand 1 looks like an easy don't raise the turn because I think he should 3bet you with anything he c/r the flop with.

[/ QUOTE ] and since he didnt 3bet turn that makes river super easy valuebet.

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?? I don't know what you guys are talking about here. Why should villain be 3betting this turn at all often? This guy is a fairly solid lagtag, so his flop c/r range should be pretty wide. We should usually have a Q with this line. The times we don't, we'll have a monster or AA/KK, or will be folding to a 3bet. So he should not be 3betting 66 or or 4x, 5x, 7x. He should just call them down.

Given the play, I don't see why the VB is good. Hands he calls with are overpairs, and any 4,5, or 7. Why are we ahead of this range?

I'm either 3betting the flop, or calling down the c/r (bet when checked to), depending on more specific reads.

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blah, i didnt play limit for awhile and now i get called in this spot by ace high like always. so my suggestion is to just everyone change your screenname and get paid off like its party.

hoppscot22 · #18 10-20-2007, 03:08 AM

i think in hand 1 people are overvaluing villains range. Put yourself in his shoes and think about ALL the hands you are checkraising against me. i feel like it is much wider the you are offering in analysis thus far.

admiralfluff · #19 10-20-2007, 03:10 AM

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Put yourself in his shoes and think about ALL the hands you are checkraising against me that call a turn raise and a river bet. i feel like it is much wider the you are offering in analysis thus far.

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I think you're missing an important part of the thought process.

hoppscot22 · #20 10-20-2007, 03:33 AM

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Put yourself in his shoes and think about ALL the hands you are checkraising against me that call a turn raise and a river bet. i feel like it is much wider the you are offering in analysis thus far.

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I think you're missing an important part of the thought process.

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i dunno, once people call the turn in these online higher stakes games, they are rarely folding the river nowadays