Caesar's Palace- Player went all in and ran away with $ after I called

[bav]

That seriously sucks, but it about fits what happened at the Rio like a year ago. This is 3rd hand, with the tales being told to me by a player who saw it and a dealer and a floor person in the room.

Someone in the 2/5 game there did EXACTLY the same thing. Said "all-in" without pushing any chips forward, got called, then simply refused to pay saying he did NOT say any such thing, someone must have misunderstood him. The guy was told if he failed to pay he would be banned from all Harrah's properties in the future. He said "fine" and they let him walk. Rio's claim was without video evidence of a crime it was gonna be a he-said/he-said thing, and they didn't think there was much hope of a conviction since the guy had never touched his chips, only declaring his bet verbally.

The player who saw it all unfold said the guy who got stiffed was offered nothing in compensation by Rio at the time. But he said that Rio management actually did make good on it later, in private, not in front of everybody in the room. They didn't want word to get around that they would cover any such losses.

It's a 3rd hand story, so I doubt everything happened exactly as described, but this is what I was told by witnesses. But after that dealers started insisting that when you went all-in you had to push some chips forward.

[AngusThermopyle]

[ QUOTE ]



They let him walk away in the sense that I'm at home now, and I'm $1,255 light.



[/ QUOTE ]

You really expected them to rip the money out of his pocket and give it to you?

[Michigan_Madman]

They declared the bet valid, and the call as well. What I expect is for that to be upheld. If it requires physical force, then yes, that is what I expect. People should be held responsible for their actions, and it doesn't always require going to court. The world we live in today is so afraid to do anything like this, but go back 100 years and this incident would have been finished and done 5 minutes after it started - with the offender paying his debt and being dismissed. He would have learned a lesson, with no need for criminal charges, and everyone moves on.

[Michigan_Madman]

This topic is cross-posted in the Beats, Brags, and Variance section.

[boondockst]

How they wont cover this is beyond me. I work at a chain franchise restaurant and we shell out that much everyday because of petty complaints. A customer who wrote in got a $100 gift card for complaining of "racism". Surely they have some way to make this right. They should give you quite a few hotel stays (off-peak of course) minimum. How many dinners did they say they'd give you?

If it was dinner at Delmonico for two, i'd be appeased. Maybe.

[cking]

My feeling is that their reputation would be important enough that they would want to show that they dont take things like this lightly and that they will protect valued customers from getting screwed

[bav]

[ QUOTE ]
My feeling is that their reputation would be important enough that they would want to show that they dont take things like this lightly and that they will protect valued customers from getting screwed

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, for valued customers with a history with them, they probably should (and that may be why in my example of this happening at Rio they did eventually compensate him--the victim was a regular). But, ya gotta look at it from their perspective--compensating folks for this could cost them enormously. Example...

How 'bout you and I go sit down at Bellagio with $100K on the table. We'll pick a hand, I'll give you a subtle signal and you'll go all-in. I'll call it. You then refuse to pay and just walk out. Bellagio will compensate me the $100K you didn't cough up, and we'll split it outside.

[Michigan_Madman]

I am a regular in this room, so they know I'm not working with this guy. I know they can't have exceptions to a rule. But if two people tried the move you're talking about for $100K, I'm sure the casino could hold off on paying until they get it from the loser in the hand. But to just say "it's not our responsibility"? Come on.

[youtalkfunny]

(EDIT TO ADD: First, I'm sorry this happened to you. This sucks. There, that's out of the way. The rest of this post rips you for expecting Caesars to reimburse you. Sorry for the harsh tone that follows.

How on earth can you expect CP to vouch for everyone who walks onto their property? "Sir, your seat is ready on Table 9. We've done extensive background checks on each of you opponents, and we are confident that they won't try to steal from you. In the unlikely event that they DO steal any of your money, don't worry, we'll make it good."

You got robbed. CP detained the suspect, and called in the law. I can't believe you would expect any more of them.

I'm no fan of the Harrah's family, but I must applaud the efforts of the dealer, floorman, casino manager, and security staff that you described in your post.

Blaming them for any of this is just plain demented. I can understand how getting gyped out of $1200 can make you very emotional. But you've got to take a deep breath, and look at this in perspective. They saw the problem, acted quickly, and did all you could possibly expect of them.

If the casino had to pay you whenever this happened, you'd see it happen every hand, until the casino closed their poker room.

[youtalkfunny]

[ QUOTE ]
He siad he is putting you all in; that is binding for poker, but who knows what a jury would say. If he is charged adn this thing goes to trial they are going to see a video tape of him not putting a thing in the pot and then throwing his cards in the muck. I would be very suprised if a prosecutor decides to prosecute this case.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not a lawyer, but I would LOVE to prosecute this case.

I've got 4-5 eyewitnesses. And if the defense wants to talk about the videotape, I'm going to ask why the defendent was stuffing his pockets and fleeing as soon as he saw his opponent's cards, before the hand was even over, before it was even his turn to act. He'll give some excuse, but nobody will buy it, in the context of the eyewitness testimony--especially if that tape shows him acting in turn for the preceding several hands.

Courts have somehow managed to get convictions for centuries before the invention of photography. You don't need a video of the crime to get a conviction.