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#11
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Assume the BB and all of the limpers will always call. If I raise, I'm investing $5 more to get $12 more into the pot. So, in a way, I'm giving myself 12-5 or 2.4-1 "odds" on the raise. [/ QUOTE ] This would be correct if you was going to either raise or fold, but it's between call or raise, so you only count the odds you're getting on the $3 raise. [ QUOTE ] Now let's instead pretend that we're playing some bizarre structure where I post a live $5 blind but it still remains $3 to call preflop. If I "raise," I'm only putting in another $1 to get the same $12 into the pot, giving myself 12-1 "odds." In theory, it would be then profitable to raise with anything I'd be willing to take 12-1 odds on to strictly call. Am I making the slightest bit of sense at all? [/ QUOTE ] This is true, but doesn't really relate to the actual hand. [/ QUOTE ] Okay. I've been known to talk out of my ass before, but less since I've been on my diet and quit eating at Taco Bell. I was working from a similar concept as to why I don't steal from the SB as often at 3/6, because I have to invest $5 to win $4. Obviously it's not totally analagous, since in a steal I'm banking on folding equity more than pot equity in this example, but I thought maybe the $5-to-raise concept would make it similar enough. |
#12
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You have enough opponents so that any overcards would be very problematic. So you're usually banking on the set potential. Your set comes in what, 9:1? So it seems like putting extra money in for your 5:1 talk is unprofitable. Do you think the 9s hold up often enough aside from the set to make up for the difference? Pocket pairs are good versus lots or a little, with a few opponents it seems better to just be happy to see the flop.
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#13
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Now let's instead pretend that we're playing some bizarre structure where I post a live $5 blind but it still remains $3 to call preflop. If I "raise," I'm only putting in another $1 to get the same $12 into the pot, giving myself 12-1 "odds." In theory, it would be then profitable to raise with anything I'd be willing to take 12-1 odds on to strictly call. Am I making the slightest bit of sense at all? [/ QUOTE ] This is true, but doesn't really relate to the actual hand. [/ QUOTE ] Okay. I've been known to talk out of my ass before, but less since I've been on my diet and quit eating at Taco Bell. I was working from a similar concept as to why I don't steal from the SB as often at 3/6, because I have to invest $5 to win $4. Obviously it's not totally analagous, since in a steal I'm banking on folding equity more than pot equity in this example, but I thought maybe the $5-to-raise concept would make it similar enough. [/ QUOTE ] Not really. The reason is that with 99 you're *ALWAYS* seeing the flop from this position, so your $2 to complete is a de facto pot contribution (proper use of latin phrase?). Therefore, the raising question is only a matter of the $3 above the de facto $2. In a blind steal, you're not presuming the $2 is already pot-ward bound, so you need to consider the whole chunk of $5 all at once. |
#14
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preflop is fine, regardless of structure
obv bet the flop |
#15
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looks like you flopped a set. I think I'd start putting money in the pot right away. [/ QUOTE ] That's what it looks like to me, too. |
#16
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OK we all know about jamming this flop--is there some other action you want to show, e.g. the turn is 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]? Let's see it!
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#17
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Nah, not really. It gets less interesting and more painful from there. Your pattern mapper isn't far off, though:
Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums) Preflop: marchron is SB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, UTG+1 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, marchron completes, BB checks. Flop: (5 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 calls. Turn: (3.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, MP3 calls. River: (5.50 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, MP3 calls. Final Pot: 7.50 BB Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF"> marchron has 9c 9s (three of a kind, nines). MP3 has Td Jc (straight, king high). Outcome: MP3 wins 7.50 BB. </font> |
#18
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[ QUOTE ]
march ron do you ever lose a hand? lol bet obv [/ QUOTE ] Sure, not only this one, but this one at a different 3/6 table not five minutes later: Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums) Preflop: marchron is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">marchron raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls. Flop: (4.33 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls. Turn: (3.16 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls. River: (5.16 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, marchron checks. Final Pot: 5.16 BB Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF"> BB has Jc Td (straight, king high). marchron has Qc Qd (three of a kind, queens). Outcome: BB wins 5.16 BB. </font> |
#19
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] march ron do you ever lose a hand? lol bet obv [/ QUOTE ] Sure, not only this one, but this one at a different 3/6 table not five minutes later: Ultimate Bet 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums) Preflop: marchron is MP2 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">marchron raises</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, BB calls. Flop: (4.33 SB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls. Turn: (3.16 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">marchron bets</font>, BB calls. River: (5.16 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> BB checks, marchron checks. Final Pot: 5.16 BB Results in white below: <font color="#FFFFFF"> BB has Jc Td (straight, king high). marchron has Qc Qd (three of a kind, queens). Outcome: BB wins 5.16 BB. </font> [/ QUOTE ] The river check behind is sexy |
#20
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The river check behind is sexy [/ QUOTE ] Seconded. Care to share the thoughts behind that, Marchron? |
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