Time's Klein on Affirmative Action - Page 2

Money2Burn · #11 12-11-2006, 05:10 PM

That being said, I don't think AA does anything to help diversity in today's society. They shouldn't be lumped together. I have no problem with diversity to a point. I fear we might be heading for some serious problems with language barriers in the near future. Othe than that though, I don't have a problem mixing several different cultures. I haven't studied the monetary pluses and minuses, so I can't really contribute in that sense.

Money2Burn · #12 12-11-2006, 05:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I've never felt rascist arguing against AA. Besides the two wrongs objection, many African Americans in this country are not poor ghetto dwellers. IMO slavery put them in a position of economic plight. That's the main injustice, being forced to the bottom of the ladder, where it can be hard to climb up. Rewarding based on race alone, to me seems less appropriate than arguing on the basis of economic status.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are absolutely right, it's not racist and you shouldn't feel racist for being against it, but try to even suggest that AA is not a good thing to most black people and they will try to crucify you. I'm just going off of personal experience here, but I think there are several examples from politics. Jeb Bush eliminating AA in FL is probably a decent one.

BCPVP · #13 12-11-2006, 05:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
And then I look at Japan where there is next to zero diversity, and I see a country that has economically kicked America's ass.

[/ QUOTE ]

O RLY?

http://www.dallasfed.org/research/ec...06/el0601.html

[/ QUOTE ]
At least I can appreciate the irony of an ardent ACist using the federal reserve as a source. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

jaxmike2 · #14 12-11-2006, 05:47 PM

So, your point is that AA is racism. I would have to agree, as would any rationally thinking person. Whenever you discriminate based on race (AA by definition) you have racism.

Whether or not it has been a good or bad thing is another matter entirely. I am sure that affirmative action has benefited some individuals, however, as a collective, I believe affirmative action hurts minority groups. Basically, it instills a negative state of mind whenever an achievement is reached that could be due to affirmative action. Furthermore, it makes a lot of whites (the majority in the US) upset that they are being discriminated against, furthering the race tension that has existed since the founding of the nation.

HeavilyArmed · #15 12-11-2006, 06:49 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So, your point is that AA is racism. I would have to agree, as would any rationally thinking person. Whenever you discriminate based on race (AA by definition) you have racism.

Whether or not it has been a good or bad thing is another matter entirely. I am sure that affirmative action has benefited some individuals, however, as a collective, I believe affirmative action hurts minority groups. Basically, it instills a negative state of mind whenever an achievement is reached that could be due to affirmative action. Furthermore, it makes a lot of whites (the majority in the US) upset that they are being discriminated against, furthering the race tension that has existed since the founding of the nation.

[/ QUOTE ]

Where have you been? Welcome. You're Shelby Steele under a pen name, yes?

Do you own asbestos underwear? Suit up and enjoy the ride.

HeavilyArmed · #16 12-11-2006, 07:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I've never felt rascist arguing against AA. Besides the two wrongs objection, many African Americans in this country are not poor ghetto dwellers. IMO slavery put them in a position of economic plight. That's the main injustice, being forced to the bottom of the ladder, where it can be hard to climb up. Rewarding based on race alone, to me seems less appropriate than arguing on the basis of economic status.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are absolutely right, it's not racist and you shouldn't feel racist for being against it, but try to even suggest that AA is not a good thing to most black people and they will try to crucify you. I'm just going off of personal experience here, but I think there are several examples from politics. Jeb Bush eliminating AA in FL is probably a decent one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here is the really deep water. If you reject AA then you must at least nod to the possibility that equality of outcome is not possible or maybe just not likely. This is construed to be racist most everywhere. Game, set and match for the PC police. Once there's a hint of racism your ideas are 100% discounted and if you did this in public you can kiss many professional positions goodbye.

Money2Burn · #17 12-11-2006, 07:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I've never felt rascist arguing against AA. Besides the two wrongs objection, many African Americans in this country are not poor ghetto dwellers. IMO slavery put them in a position of economic plight. That's the main injustice, being forced to the bottom of the ladder, where it can be hard to climb up. Rewarding based on race alone, to me seems less appropriate than arguing on the basis of economic status.

[/ QUOTE ]

You are absolutely right, it's not racist and you shouldn't feel racist for being against it, but try to even suggest that AA is not a good thing to most black people and they will try to crucify you. I'm just going off of personal experience here, but I think there are several examples from politics. Jeb Bush eliminating AA in FL is probably a decent one.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here is the really deep water. If you reject AA then you must at least nod to the possibility that equality of outcome is not possible or maybe just not likely. This is construed to be racist most everywhere. Game, set and match for the PC police. Once there's a hint of racism your ideas are 100% discounted and if you did this in public you can kiss many professional positions goodbye.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is completely true, and the thing that is really frustrating is basicly anything ideas that may contradict or even differ from the "black leadership" (Jesse Jackson, louis Farrakhan, etc.) in the country is automaticly labled as racist and therefor discredited.

elwoodblues · #18 12-11-2006, 08:03 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you for what I predict will be one of the few civil posts in this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Funny that you expected civil posts given the tenor of your initial post in the thread "idealogical pigs."

HeavilyArmed · #19 12-11-2006, 09:30 PM

I bumped into this as well. Details the MI AA bill and the GOP. linky Long.

HeavilyArmed · #20 12-11-2006, 09:34 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Thank you for what I predict will be one of the few civil posts in this thread.

[/ QUOTE ]

Funny that you expected civil posts given the tenor of your initial post in the thread "idealogical pigs."

[/ QUOTE ]

Either your sarcasm* is above the rim or it's cocktail hour in Chicago. Have one for me.

* Almost nevers works in a message board environment.