***OFFICIAL*** LOST Season 3 Episode 14 Discussion -spoiler free-

[NLSoldier]

I thought this was a very good ep. It made me totally forget about the locke storyline. I really like the theory that Homer or someone posted.

[Assani Fisher]

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Charlie,

wtf man you're the king of dropping pseudo spoilers.

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Agreed, we get it, we know you work in Hollywood. You do this every chance you get it seems like. Put stuff in white like the rest of us if it's a spoiler please.

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no its actually me just stating the OBVIOUS. they were buried in a hole in the ground about 2-3 feet deep and the dirt was about 3 feet high above the ground-baring something happening in the next episode or two...which starts right where this episode ended-THEY ARE DEAD.

But they can come back just like Boone will come back every season. The writers get off on [censored] with our heads...everyone complained about.."what about all the other people in the background" why can't we ever see them.
They pick two people to show...everyone says "oh god what are u doing, we want to see Locke and Jack not these two retards" They wrote themselves into a corner...much like they did with Boone. It was never planed at the start that Boone would die in season 1. The writers through there own fault/doing created a weak character and realized the best way to get some use out of them would be to kill them off.

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I have more faith in the writers than you do. I think its all been planned out more in advance and that they're not just doing things at the request of the audience.

As for them not being dead, we're given quite a few hints that they may not die:

-the line in Nikki's tv show about her not having really died
-Locke saying to Paulo something like "you can't keep anything buried on this island."
-the dog sniffing at them and pulling the tarp off

Edited to add: Also $8 million worth of diamonds being in the grave gives the characters plenty of motivation to dig them back up.

[Assani Fisher]

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Charlie,

wtf man you're the king of dropping pseudo spoilers.

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out of curiosity what is a pseudo spoiler?

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its means fake spoiler:


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spoiler noun [C]
a piece of information about a film, book or electronic game which can spoil the enjoyment of someone experiencing it for the first time
spoiling noun <u>

‘The most successful new-wave criticism is that of the “spoiler”. Spoilers are cultural hackers and leakers. They penetrate the high-security fence that studios erect around their new projects. Spoiling requires ingenuity, “sources” (suborned, of course) and a propensity to media felony. The net is the Wild West. No law between the website and Dodge City.’
(The Guardian, 29th April 2002)

In the recent past, the primary definition of spoiler talked about a mechanism on an aircraft or on the rear of a car which reduced lift and increased performance at high speeds. In 2004, an investigation of spoiler using the Google™ search engine does not reveal a top hit in the engineering domain, but rather in the world of electronic gaming, where interested parties can visit a website, www.the-spoiler.com, which prematurely reveals cheats and solutions to gaming puzzles.

This new sense of spoiler has been around since the mid-nineties, and initially referred to pieces of information which reveal elements of the plot of a film or book. Since proper enjoyment of a plot depends on dramatic tension and suspense, prematurely discovering what is going to happen “spoils” the experience that the viewer or reader has when watching or reading for the first time. The usage was later applied in the gaming world, where it refers to pieces of information which signal the solution to a game or puzzle and therefore deny the user the pleasure of working things out for themselves. In both contexts, spoiler appears productively in compounds such as total spoiler, quasi-spoiler (quasi- as a prefix meaning ‘part’), and pseudo-spoiler (pseudo- meaning ‘fake’).

Initially, spoilers only appeared on specialist Internet sites and newsgroup postings, preceded by a warning and ensuring that the user had to make a definite decision to read them by clicking on a specific link. In recent times, however, such warnings have been omitted and many readers have unwittingly spoiled their own enjoyment of new films, books and games.

More recently, this new sense of spoiler entered the world of journalism, where it spawned a participle noun for the activity: spoiling. A landmark case in journalistic spoiling occurred in 2000 when Hello magazine published unauthorised photographs of the wedding of Michael Douglas and Catherine Zeta-Jones, thereby violating the £1 million exclusive rights to the story purchased by rival magazine OK! Media coverage of the lawsuits which followed referred to the activities of Hello magazine as a spoiler operation. The term spoiler-crit (crit as a short form for criticism) has also been used during recent years to refer to Internet-based reviews of films and television programmes posted significantly before their general release.



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[Assani Fisher]

wtf happened to Rose and Bernard?

[kidcolin]

it means "fake spoiler", but I chose words poorly in the heat of the moment. "quasi spoiler" would've been better. You have in the past said lots of things like "but wait til you see who's contract isn't renewed" while we're discussing characters X, Y, and Z. Things along those lines.

[Assani Fisher]

one theory...

if the smoke monster is "the box" which gives a person whatever they want, then perhaps it was giving Paulo his wish- to have Nikki suffer the same fate as him.


Oh, and I finally thought of one thing that was accomplished in tonight's episode: The Losties now have a walkie talkie, and I'd assume that they can communicate with the Others on it. This is actually pretty big news imo.

[Moozh]

I think one thing that it helped explain (which may have been obvious), was not just why they wanted Kate and Sawyer, but why they treated them the way they did. Putting them in cages and forcing them to do meaningless manual labor didn't make any sense, but now it looks like it was just an attempt to isolate them and get Kate to sleep with Sawyer. Then, at the opportune time, Jack was shown the two of them lying together and almost immediately agreed to do the surgery.

Ben: I find what a person (Jack) cares about most (Kate) and I pull the strings.

Also, to agree with others:

"We could always bring you back for next season"
"Promise me we won't end up like them"
"Things don't stay buried on this island for long"

They're not dead.

[RunDownHouse]

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It was never planed at the start that Boone would die in season 1.

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Big "lol" at stuff like this basically being what you're so adamantly proclaiming you don't do. Its just a lack of thought beyond whatever moment your fingers are running over the keyboard.

All,

About halfway through this showing I caught myself thinking, "meh, kind of boring episode." Talk about the power of an ending to redeem - or ruin - an entire endeavor. By the end, loved the whole thing, and whoever said it was reminiscent of Tales From the Crypt nailed it. Never really watched Twilight Zone, but the Tales comment put a name to the face I had on the tip of my tongue.

[Assani Fisher]

Official ABC Summary:

Skimpy outfits...heavy, pounding music...a crowd of excited men waving money in the air...It can only mean one thing: there's a stripper on Lost, and it's Nikki! She works the stage with abandon, then notices a man sneaking into a back room.She runs off the stage, confronts the man and is shot! Nikki dies...and then we hear, "Cut!" Turns out Nikki's not a stripper - she's an actress on the TV show Exposé that films in Sydney.She's also having an affair with the septuagenarian executive producer, Howard L.Zuckerman, who of course is very married and very wealthy.

On the island, Nikki runs like mad through the jungle, stops, digs a hole, and buries something.Then she runs to the beach camp, where Sawyer and Hurley are playing ping-pong, and collapses right in front of them.She struggles to eke out one unintelligible word and then dies!

Sawyer and Hurley begin an investigation and find Paulo's body in the jungle.He's dead, too.They search Nikki and Paulo's tent for clues and find a bug collection.

Charlie says they were Dr.Arzt's collection.Sawyer finds a walkie talkie.He says the Others had similar walkie talkies, which means they were working with the Others.Hurley doesn't think the Others are near their camp, but Sun vehemently reminds them that she was abducted.If she hadn't gotten away, they would've killed her.Charlie knows that isn't true - he was the one who grabbed her.Sawyer tries to calm them down and says he'll do a perimeter sweep.But when he shows off his gun, Hurley becomes suspicious.

Hurley asks Desmond to use his psychic powers to see who killed Nikki and Paulo.Desmond says it doesn't work that way, but offers that he saw Nikki arguing with Sawyer earlier this morning right before she died.Hurley tells Charlie and Sun his theory.Sun says Sawyer's not a murderer - she's convinced it's the Others.Feeling guilty, Charlie confesses to Sun that it was him who took her.Sun is stunned.He explains why he did it, and as the horror of it washes over her, Sun simply walks away.

Sawyer says he argued with Nikki because she wanted a gun.He didn't give it to her, and she was mad.He didn't tell them earlier because he noticed dirt under Nikki's fingernails and realized she was burying something.He hands Sun a pouch filled with diamonds.

While Sawyer is digging the graves, Sun tells him she knows it was his idea to kidnap her.It's a tense moment.He asks if she's going to tell Jin, and she says no.If she does, they'll have to dig another grave - then she slaps him, hard, and leaves.

WHOOSH BACK 84 days ago when Nikki eats breakfast with Zuckerman.He introduces his new chef, Paulo, to her.It seems like the first time they have met, but then Zuckerman falls over, dead.Paulo poisoned him.Paulo and Nikki are lovers, and it was their plan to kill Zuckerman and steal the stash of diamonds he had hidden in his safe.

80 days ago: waiting for their flight, Paulo has hidden the diamonds in an Exposé bag.They see Shannon and Boone looking for a table.

Shannon is rude and snotty while Boone apologizes for her behavior.Nikki makes Paulo promise they'll never end up like them.

The crash: Nikki frantically searches for Paulo.She finds him and asks about the diamonds, expressing no concern for him.Paulo doesn't know where the bag is.75 days ago: Nikki and Paulo root through the scavenged luggage looking for the diamonds.They meet Ethan, who tells them they might find their bag further inland.They then listen as Jack gives his "live together, die alone" speech.

57 days ago: Dr.Arzt shows Nikki his latest acquisition: latrodectus regina, the dangerous Medusa spider.Nikki flirts with him, and he draws a map to help her find her luggage.Using Arzt's map, Nikki and Paulo search in the jungle for the bag.They find the Nigerian plane nestled in the tree top and the Pearl station hatch in the ground.

48 days ago: Nikki learns that Sawyer and Kate found the case of guns, and drags Paulo out to the waterfall.He dives in, finds the bag with the diamonds but lies to Nikki about it.

31 days ago: Paulo hides the diamonds inside the Pearl station bathroom toilet.As he's about to leave, Ben and Juliet climb down into the station.Paulo hides and watches Ben use the monitors to show Juliet who Jack is.He'll convince Jack to do the surgery by finding out what he's emotionally invested in and exploit it.

9 days ago: Locke, Desmond, Nikki and Paulo at the Pearl station.Paulo pretends to use the bathroom and recovers the diamonds.

This morning: Nikki realizes Paulo has the diamonds, and the cold, calculating, murdering side of Nikki emerges.She demands a gun from Sawyer, but he won't give her one.She then lures Paulo out into the jungle and throws Arzt's Medusa spider on him.It bites him and paralyzes him.The poison won't kill him but it makes him seem dead. Then she hears the strange sounds of the smoke monster.She looks around but doesn't see it. Paulo signals for her to look down, and she sees another spider on her ankle.It bites her! Her fate is sealed.She immediately runs off, hiding the diamonds for herself later when the paralysis wears off.

She stumbles up to Hurley and Sawyer and tries to explain what happened but falls over, seemingly dead.

WHOOSH to their funeral.Sawyer dumps the diamonds over Nikki and Paulo while he and Hurley grimly shovel dirt onto their bodies.But then Nikki's eye pops open! Surely somebody will notice and stop.But nobody does.They continue shoveling dirt until finally the grave is full.Rest in peace, Nikki and Paulo.Rest in peace.

[nyg23]

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one theory...
if the smoke monster is "the box" which gives a person whatever they want, then perhaps it was giving Paulo his wish- to have Nikki suffer the same fate as him.
Oh, and I finally thought of one thing that was accomplished in tonight's episode: The Losties now have a walkie talkie, and I'd assume that they can communicate with the Others on it. This is actually pretty big news imo.


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I think the radio may have been the sole purpose of the two of them. Knowing what the Others are doing via. walkie talkie transmissions would be a huge.

Also Paulo didn't want Nikki to get bitten. He was warning her by using his eyes as he was already unable to speak from the paralysis. I bought into his little speech about how he was afraid of losing her. Although then he could have just never retrieved the bag, but then the writers wouldn't have the ability to get the walkie talkie to the Losties on a time delay.

As for all the foreshadowing that they aren't dead, it just seems to blatant and obvious which is very unlike the Lost writers, who usually make subtle hints. I think its just a way of keeping us guessing and throwing us off the main purpose of the episode which is getting the walkie talkie to the Losties. Also, like someone said, its uncharacteristic of episodes to pick up right from the end of the last so I'm thinking they're dead. But if they're not I hope Vincent is the reason they dig them up as already stated.

P.S. throwing away 8 million dollars worth of diamonds is stupid no matter where you are stuck...CMON!!!