[150NL] 88 Flopped set 550bb's Deep - Page 17

Fonkey123 · #**161** 11-23-2007, 07:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

That said the villain hardly ever doesn't push AK in the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

so some tag gets to the turn with only 35 BB's in the pot and sees that his TPTK just improved to top 2 pair...
and he 3 bets the turn for over 200BB's, gets called there but isnt alarmed, and then still shoves over 300BB's more on the river with AK?
just because hes "in the moment"?

[/ QUOTE ]

You really think he's gonna c/f? I mean honestly, people don't c/f with top 2 in the moment.

bilbo-san · #**162** 11-23-2007, 07:25 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think you've been spot on the whole thread loos. Sickest spot ever though. I'd like to meet the man who folds this on the turn while actually playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of the sickest spots I've ever seen.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see set-over-set like 5 times a week, and I don't even play much...wtf. How is this so sick? Because we're deep?

How does playing deep make you immune from coolers?

Furthermore, if villains were as tight-passive as 80% of posters playing here seem to suggest, why the [censored] aren't you destroying the games? Shouldn't you be raising this turn with practically any two, ALL the time, if you think villain needs AK to even CALL?

If Villain's not pushing this river with AK for value, then you are not exploiting your position vs. him enough this deep. Which probably means you don't have enough buyins to play this deep.

cs3 · #**163** 11-23-2007, 07:31 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

That said the villain hardly ever doesn't push AK in the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

so some tag gets to the turn with only 35 BB's in the pot and sees that his TPTK just improved to top 2 pair...
and he 3 bets the turn for over 200BB's, gets called there but isnt alarmed, and then still shoves over 300BB's more on the river with AK?
just because hes "in the moment"?

[/ QUOTE ]

You really think he's gonna c/f? I mean honestly, people don't c/f with top 2 in the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude are you forgetting about the turn action? wtf? its a combination of the turn + river action! its not like all of a sudden were at the river, nothing happened before, and villain wants to shove 300'BBs with top 2.

nobody seems to be thinking about what HERO must be putting villain on. villain has to realize that hero must give villain an incredibly stong range to 3 bet that turn on a dryass board, and then still value shove river for 300bb's.

the psychological aspects of poker DO and SHOULD affect decision making much more than some people care to admit

Speedlimits · #**164** 11-23-2007, 07:32 PM

This is AK way more than AA/KK

44 is in his range too.

call

Keyser. · #**165** 11-23-2007, 07:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think you've been spot on the whole thread loos. Sickest spot ever though. I'd like to meet the man who folds this on the turn while actually playing.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is one of the sickest spots I've ever seen.

[/ QUOTE ]

I see set-over-set like 5 times a week, and I don't even play much...wtf. How is this so sick? Because we're deep?

How does playing deep make you immune from coolers?

Furthermore, if villains were as tight-passive as 80% of posters playing here seem to suggest, why the [censored] aren't you destroying the games? Shouldn't you be raising this turn with practically any two, ALL the time, if you think villain needs AK to even CALL?

If Villain's not pushing this river with AK for value, then you are not exploiting your position vs. him enough this deep. Which probably means you don't have enough buyins to play this deep.

[/ QUOTE ]

biblo, 3rd set 550 (!) bbs deep vs. a likely range of AA/KK/44/AK is not a sick spot? This isn't a normal set over set, and honestly this entire thread is why deep games are profitable b/c people (even good players) just think about the hand in the same way as if they were 100bbs deep.

You can't raise any two on the turn here b/c villain has AA/KK/44/AK wayyyyy too often to bluff (like he leads into 5 people then bets an ace turn)... ya he's prolly strong. Also a turn bluff raise risks $100 to win around $90 which isn't good enough vs. his range.

Fonkey123 · #**166** 11-23-2007, 07:40 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

That said the villain hardly ever doesn't push AK in the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

so some tag gets to the turn with only 35 BB's in the pot and sees that his TPTK just improved to top 2 pair...
and he 3 bets the turn for over 200BB's, gets called there but isnt alarmed, and then still shoves over 300BB's more on the river with AK?
just because hes "in the moment"?

[/ QUOTE ]

You really think he's gonna c/f? I mean honestly, people don't c/f with top 2 in the moment.

[/ QUOTE ]

dude are you forgetting about the turn action? wtf? its a combination of the turn + river action! its not like all of a sudden were at the river, nothing happened before, and villain wants to shove 300'BBs with top 2.

nobody seems to be thinking about what HERO must be putting villain on. villain has to realize that hero must give villain an incredibly stong range to 3 bet that turn on a dryass board, and then still value shove river for 300bb's.

the psychological aspects of poker DO and SHOULD affect decision making much more than some people care to admit

[/ QUOTE ]

Okay, you are so off base here my mind is starting to hurt. Villains never check/fold top 2 on the river and usually 3 bets the turn as well with AK. Once at the river I can hardly ever see him not shoving top 2.

As hero since villain can have AK or 44 you snap call.

Keyser. · #**167** 11-23-2007, 07:49 PM

I've logged about 120k hands at this limit and I'm telling you a reasonable villain (and in this hand the villain is reasonable) would not "usually" play AK like that, and in reality he probably only does like 25% of the time (which incidentally might be enough to call).

cs3 · #**168** 11-23-2007, 07:52 PM

also, still waiting to see a reply to this challenge:

[ QUOTE ]
for all those saying this is an easy river call i challenge you to find a single hand from .5/1NL - 2/4NL and post teh HH where either:
1) a TAG gets all in with 2 pairs for over 500+ bb's or
2) a TAG gets in 500+ bb's after the turn with bottom set or less

[/ QUOTE ]

go ahead look in any .5/1 - 2/4 data base you can get your hands on. if this is an autocall it should be pretty easy to find at last one example. $20 star transfer to the first person that posts a legit HH

edit - guess i should end this lets say saturday, 11/24/07 at midnight just in case it gets dug up 3 years from now...

loosbastard · #**169** 11-23-2007, 08:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]

I see set-over-set like 5 times a week, and I don't even play much...wtf. How is this so sick? Because we're deep?

[/ QUOTE ]

adfksdgkfdg...this thread is making my head asplode. Of course it's because we're deep. Saying his range doesn't change "just because we're deep" is absolutely ridiculous.

[ QUOTE ]
Villains never check/fold top 2 on the river and usually 3 bets the turn as well with AK. Once at the river I can hardly ever see him not shoving top 2.

[/ QUOTE ]

And what is he expecting to get value from? Shoving AK is super super thin w/ these stacks. I mean what does he put us on after calling the turn 3-bet? We have 444/888 here practically every single time.

kaby · #**170** 11-23-2007, 09:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Villains usually 3 bets the turn as well with AK.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is not correct

[ QUOTE ]
Once at the river I can hardly ever see him not shoving top 2.

[/ QUOTE ]

this is

really, river is a snapcall once you get there, but the turn 3bet call really isn't as standard as some people make it out to be

i think it's a turn + river call, but i also think it's very close