Nobel Prize scientist - Black people are dumb

[tarheeljks]

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Stated differently, we could devise social policies around whatever the truth is, rather than whatever makes PC elitists comfortable.

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are you saying something to the effect of not putting as much money into educating minorities?

[JMAnon]

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Stated differently, we could devise social policies around whatever the truth is, rather than whatever makes PC elitists comfortable.

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are you saying something to the effect of not putting as much money into educating minorities?

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Of course not. But maybe we could give up affirmative action. Or we could get rid of the aspect of employment discrimination laws that effectively forbid hiring criteria (like aptitude tests) that have "disparate impacts" on different racial groups.

[jogsxyz]

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.......... But maybe we could give up affirmative action. Or we could get rid of the aspect of employment discrimination laws that effectively forbid hiring criteria (like aptitude tests) that have "disparate impacts" on different racial groups.

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It never worked. Affirmative action is a great boom to
middle class blacks. It never helped the ghetto blacks
unless they were good in sports.

[InTheDark]

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It matters for any number of reasons. For example, if people can rationalize the lower achievements in income and education for blacks compared to whites with the explanation that they're genetically inferior, there would be less reason to devise social and political policies to try to alleviate the income and education disparities.

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In America, we've taken this route for 40 years and some difficult to quantify pile of money, certainly 100s of billions. What did this produce? Point to the great narrowing of gap in educational outcomes. There's no doubt that in the first few years some opportunities for blacks were opened up but this trend was in place before 1960.

I can easily point to metrics where our grand social engineering program has failed in a massive way. Out of wedlock birth and family formation are the most obvious and in my opinion ,possibly the root of the systemic failure to improve black outcomes as compared to whites. I don't think the black/white violent crime differential has narrowed at all (it's still roughly 5 to 1).

Maybe give it 40 more years? Sure, it's only time and money. Plus, we don't want the guilty white liberals to feel any more guilty.

[andyfox]

We can certainly argue the merits of affirmative action or other policies. What I'm saying is that if a bigot uses his scientific credentials to label a particular group as genetically stupid, and that view takes hold, then it might be used to sustain or justify particular social or political policies. The policies--or their opposites--might succeed or fail for other reasons entirely.

[andyfox]

One would certainly think that dealing with the truth, instead of what makes us comfortable, would result in a more efficacious policy. What I'm saying is that to base programs on a bigot's biased interpretation of data would result in bad policies.

[Fly]

andy,

1) Do you think that believing in an intelligence gap based partially in genetics makes someone a bigot?

2) Do you understand that it is possible to be a (true) bigot and still be right (sometimes)?

3) Stop killing the messenger.

[InTheDark]

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We can certainly argue the merits of affirmative action or other policies. What I'm saying is that if a bigot uses his scientific credentials to label a particular group as genetically stupid, and that view takes hold, then it might be used to sustain or justify particular social or political policies. The policies--or their opposites--might succeed or fail for other reasons entirely.

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Right or wrong, it was accepted common knowledge that blacks were intellectually inferior to whites until the mid-20th century. Along comes the civil rights movement and now we must purge this piece of ancient accepted truth because it doesn't fit the new plan for equality. The huge mistake was assuming that equality of opportunity would lead to equal outcomes. The second huge mistake was not valuing observed truth from past centuries and building an entire 'scientific' front with the sole purpose of discrediting the ideas and definitions of race, IQ and racial differences. This was not science but science in the interest of a political agenda, a very common affront today.

If your intent is to research racial differences today you are almost unable to begin. Your academic standing and career will be in jeopardy at the start. Who can jump in here? No one. The orthodoxy will be unassailed. A more unhealthy scientific environment is hard to imagine.

What's gained if and when racial intelligence differences are accepted again in America? Honesty, for one. Efficiency in so many areas, for another. The waste of poor resource allocation is the one that pisses me off the most. Sending ill equipped students into valuable university spots simply because they're the 'right' race offends me to the core. Law schools are the worst offenders here.

There's more but I must go.

[Jamougha]

ITD,

the problem with your argument is that people are publishing research on the issue without being vilified or having their careers ended. Making random racist comments is another matter.

[tame_deuces]

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andy,

1) Do you think that believing in an intelligence gap based partially in genetics makes someone a bigot?

2) Do you understand that it is possible to be a (true) bigot and still be right (sometimes)?

3) Stop killing the messenger.

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There isn't a genetic intelligence gap. The intelligence is pretty much exactly the same when measured in v/ young children.

If anything, if you believe in the intelligence measures (g factor etc) and you trust the research that has found differences then the only explanation left is cultural difference and/or inequality in treatment.