July Thread for Very Important LIMIT Hold 'em Discussion

[Harv72b]

I guess it says something about your recent playing habits when full tilt offers you a $25 bonus which pays out in $2.50 increments. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

[Bob T.]

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I guess it says something about your recent playing habits when full tilt offers you a $25 bonus which pays out in $2.50 increments.

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thanks, haven't sprayed cocacola on my keyboard for a while. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[James.]

i played some tourneys last night for the first time in a long while. i came to the realization that i'm a two-outer magnet on the bubble in sitngos. also, i seem to suck at razz. especially when i'm sort of out of my head and keep folding live draws on 6th street thinking all of the cards are out. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[HoneyBadger]

I played a PL 5-card draw SNG for fun. I was dealt a flush, so I pot it, one caller. He goes first, takes one, and I pull a very obvious stand pat bluff. He checks, I pot it, he repots it all-in, and being the moron I am, I call. He shows a higher flush, obviously.

[Harv72b]

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i played some tourneys last night for the first time in a long while. i came to the realization that i'm a two-outer magnet on the bubble in sitngos. also, i seem to suck at razz. especially when i'm sort of out of my head and keep folding live draws on 6th street thinking all of the cards are out. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

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You should play a HU LHE tournament tonight on Stars, something in the $5+0.50 range. Also a $10+1 HORSE tourney. Not sure where you could find such things, tho. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[ProfessorBen]

I'm an idiot. I can't get PAHUD to display the stats on tables. I need the elephant in the green suit to get on AIM. Back to Harry Potter for now. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[MrWookie]

Tonight is the biggest night of KOTKP festivities. We're starting in 30 min with a HU LHE tourney. At 7pm EDT, we have NLHE. At 8 pm, there's HORSE, and finally at 9, there's the main event, LHE. HU and NL are $5.50, HORSE and LHE are $11.

[Harv72b]

As a few of you knew, I've been playing "professionally" for a little over a year now. Just small stakes, just online, but that's been my sole source of income since last May, which I guess qualifies me as a "pro". In the good ol' days of Neteller (which I could never use, but still), EFTs, and of course Party Poker, that career choice pretty much rocked; I was raking in all the money I needed plus a little just by 3- or 4-tabling the 3/6 & 5/10 games. I never really talked about my win rate back in those days, but I'll tell you now that it was good. As in, over 3 BB/100 good over a sample size well into the 6-figure realm. I don't know if the games were that soft or if I just happened to develop a near-perfect playing style to exploit them, but it truly was easy money, and I got by very well just by putting in 20-25 hours/week. Of course, my living expenses are pretty low.

But ever since the UIGEA hit town & Party closed up shop for us, I just haven't been able to keep up financially. Rakeback helped & probably added 3-4 months to my "career" as a "pro", but in the end the bills caught up & then passed my ability to earn. My current database is showing a win rate of 0.6 BB/100 in the 2/4 thru 5/10 games on full tilt, over around 75k hands. It's too long to just be a downswing, so I have to face the facts & admit that I'm just not good enough to make it as a pro under these conditions.

So I re-entered the daily workforce again today. I've cashed out what remains of my bankroll from Full Tilt, down to around $150 which I hope to run back up to a respectable number while once again playing recreationally. That means that you guys won't be seeing me on the small stakes tables for a while. I'll still be around on here, of course, acting like I know what I'm talking about. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

I'll end this post with a few of my hard-won lessons as a "pro", or whatever I was, for any of you entertaining thoughts of walking down that road:

-Poker becomes much less fun when you have to do it, but I suspect that's true of just about everything.

-If you're going to go pro, make sure that you can actually handle 8-10 hours days of multi-tabling. I couldn't, and that hurt me as much as anything else.

-Those minimum bankroll guidelines, and especially having at least 3 months' living expenses stashed away (6 months' being better) are imperative. I may well have been homeless by now if it weren't for those two things.

-If you have a spouse and/or children, don't do it. At the least not while you're still only bankrolled/equipped for small stakes play.

-If you aren't using a trackball style mouse, get one. It takes some getting used to, but boy will it save the wear & tear on your wrist & arm.

-Remember, just like any other sector of the economy, poker can & will fluctuate. Those couple of years between Moneymaker's win and the UIGEA were one hell of a boom, but I don't think anyone will deny that those days are over now. Even if you're good enough now, there's no guarantee that you'll be good enough a year or two from now...so always have an out.

-All that aside, being able to go to sleep & wake up whenever you want to, "commuting" between your bed and your desk, working in your underwear, and all those other nice things that come along with being your own boss, truly do rule. I miss that already.

Oh, by the way...JJH excluded, you all suck for not playing KOTKP over the weekend. Unless you did play, then you're also excluded. It was a lot of fun & just as donkerrific at times as any 2+2 game I remember. Besides which, if y'all had played then maybe someone from small stakes actually would've won one. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[KitCloudkicker]

Harv,

Sorry to hear about it...What jobs are you looking at?

I'm kinda discouraged about your recent online poker experiences. I was thinking about getting back in the online game, but if you're only at 0.6 BB/100 then I probably have no shot. When I first started playing, I played online (this was way before UIGEA, like 2004ish), and could beat the 3/6 full tilt game pretty handily by playing ABC TAG and not even using pokertracker. Then I got into live play, got crushed, and had to remodel my game completely before figuring out how to beat it. Now it sounds like I'll have to completely remodel it again to beat the new supertight online game...something I'm not particularly keen on doing. Would you even recommend playing very small limits (like 0.50/1), just for enjoyment if nothing else? What is the highest limit you'd say is beatable for 1 BB/hr?

FWIW, I think there must be as yet undiscovered optimal strategy for these new online games that hasnt really been discovered. As they say, for every strategy that these online players are using, theres a perfect counterstrategy.

Anyways, I wish you the best of luck. Your advice is always appreciated.

Kit C

PS - are you going to consider playing more live? the games are still as good and easy as ever.

[Harv72b]

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Sorry to hear about it...What jobs are you looking at?

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I'm selling cell phones. Not a huge job market out there for underachieving college dropouts who understand pot equity. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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Would you even recommend playing very small limits (like 0.50/1), just for enjoyment if nothing else? What is the highest limit you'd say is beatable for 1 BB/hr?

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I don't think it's impossible to beat any limit for 1 BB/hr, online or anywhere. At least to this point, it looks like I can't do it at my current skill level & with my current style of play (or lack thereof). That's not to say that you or anyone else couldn't. And poker still rocks so of course I recommend playing it. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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are you going to consider playing more live? the games are still as good and easy as ever.

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I've never played live, at least not beyond friendly games over many beers against people who don't know if an ace is high or low. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] I've thought about it & probably will make the drive up to AC at some point, but at least for now I don't have the funds available to give it a shot.