Joe Navarro book, Nov 7th

[Quaalude]

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I'm not talking about law, I'm talking about ethics and morality. If you read a book in a bookstore, the author is not being fairly compensated for his work. If you read a book in a library, the author was compensated, and you are paying through your taxes that bought the book and support the library.

Granted, intellectual property law is a mess, and nearly impossible to enforce. That doesn't make it right to take an author's ideas without paying him. It is a matter of principle. He did the work, and he is offering it to the public for a price. If you make use of his work, you have an obligation to pay what he asks for using his work. If you don't want to pay what he is asking, don't use his work. If you can't afford it, you can't afford to play poker.

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This discussion has the potential to tangent off into a protracted debate (probably better suited to a different forum) that I have no interest in getting involved with at the present time, so I'll just say this and be done with it:

I have no ethical issues with reading a book in its entirety in a bookstore and then deciding whether or not to buy it. In my view it is neither immoral nor unethical. Whether I read a book in a library, in a bookstore, buy a copy and take it home, or borrow a friend's copy, it's all the same to me.

[jimpo]

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To your point of the top sellers lets take a look at the USA Today best sellers for this week:

1. Morrigan's Cross, Nora Roberts,Jove
Romance: Hoyt must save his twin brother from a she-vampire

...

15. I Feel Bad About My Neck Nora Ephron, Knopf
About getting older

Many of these books are not in consideration for the Pulitzer or any other prizes. The country's obsession for a certain book has very little correlation to if it is actually a well-written and critically acclaimed work.


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The same is true for the Amazon sales ranking. I think you are missing the point here.

[Erik W]

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So having the type of sales we have had at those prices is amazingly good, and I think you'll agree." I do agree, and I think your price is highway robbery. You damn well better be giving good royalties at that price; your reader certainly is being overcharged.

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I think they are a bargain with the content they hold.
I'd happily buy every 2+2 book that ever get published from now on for 500$ a piece.

[Erik W]

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Hey, Mason, I am familiar with side games. Tell you what, Joe is presenting a seminar on poker tells in Vegas at Caesar's Palace in November. How about you and me getting together and play a $10,000 head-to-head freezeout. I'd really enjoy that. Wouldn't cost anymore than your WSOP entry.

Best wishes,
Marv

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Make it HORSE.

[Cactus Jack]

OT:

Authors (that I know and it's a bunch) do not mind people borrowing books from the library or friends, and probably don't mind people reading them in a bookstore. They DO have a problem with USED bookstores as they get no revenue from the royalties, but the used bookstore owner gets revenue from their work. Even if they've been paid already for that copy, it's hard to swallow.

But that pails in comparison to what publishers do to them, so reading a book in a bookstore is probably very low on the radar screen to all authors. After all, they do it because they want people to read their words as much as to get paid for it--often the higher compensation.

CJ--who's been down that path, too

[Mason Malmuth]

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But that pails in comparison to what publishers do to them

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The reason I got into the publishing business 20 years ago is because my publisher at the time went bankrupt and didn't put my book out after he had it for two years, he also wouldn't give it back. So I had to hire an attorney and wrestle the book back. It was a very unpleasant experience.

Partly from this, we have made it a major part of our operation to treat our authors well. This includes not only royalties that are far higher than industry standards, but we also try to recognize which books have done better than originally expected and then reward that author in other ways. So when we say that our authors on average make five times as much as they would from many other publishers, it is often far better than that in the long run.

One of the reasons that we can do this, is not only are we experts in the subject matter that we deal with, we also know our market. Thus every book that we have brought out has shown a profit. Compare this to other publishers who just seem to put books out with little concern with their quality or prospects. These publishers must treat most of their authors poorly since they themselves also do poorly on most of their published books.

So let me make it clear that your comments do not apply to us in any way what so ever.

MM

[Cactus Jack]

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But that pails in comparison to what publishers do to them

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So let me make it clear that your comments do not apply to us in any way what so ever.

MM

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Absolutely clear, without mistake, and with reservations by none. Heartfelt congratulations. Now, do not become so big and so successful that you lose control to the beancounters, who can maximize your profits and the profits to the shareholders of the multi-national corporation by screwing the authors at every opportunity in order to squeeze another corporate perk out of them.

Forget killing all the lawyers. Kill the accountants and we'll have less need for lawyers.

[YouKnobber]

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It is no different than downloading bootleg music or movies or software on the internet. It is no different than stealing cash from an obnoxious drunk at a casino. It's still his money.

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Downloading music/movies is copyright infringment. Also, reading a book in a store and making a copy of a music file don't seem the same to me. If you were to Xerox the book and take it with you then perhaps they are the same.

Edit: Additionally, Id just like to make it absolutely clear that I do not endorse the PPA in any way.