**Official uNL Microbrew thread: August PT 2** - Page 111

Sean Fraley · #**1101** 08-27-2007, 03:20 AM

For anyone PokerStars players who are interested, playing the 2700 FPP or 5400 FPP sattelites that award 4 seats to the Sunday Million turned out to be a nice way to turn my 18.5k FPPs into $670. Play the SNG in pure survival mode, win a seat, unregister from the tourney, and then sell the T$s in the marketplace thread here. I had three offers to by the lot in less than two minutes at better than $0.98 on the dollar. With the WCOOP coming up, it's a sellers market right now.

Gelford · #**1102** 08-27-2007, 03:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Call and let him hang himself.

[/ QUOTE ]
I on the other hand like to just get it in ... If nothing else, if discourages bluffing you

When against thinking players (which might not be the case here), I will play hardball with my marginal hands and hell if the pot is small, I will sometimes show down semi-garbage like buttom pair as long as it is only a slight mistake. (that is, I suspect to be slightly behing villians range but not crushed, so I might win an occasional showdown)

Gotta protect myself and make them think I'm not worth bluffing (a concept borrowed from Schneids limit Cardrunners vids)

But the above of course does no apply here, what applies here is that a lot of cards can scare both you an villian, so you want him sucked in while he shows interest (and your are ahead of his range btw)

eurythmech · #**1103** 08-27-2007, 03:54 AM

[ QUOTE ]
For anyone PokerStars players who are interested, playing the 2700 FPP or 5400 FPP sattelites that award 4 seats to the Sunday Million turned out to be a nice way to turn my 18.5k FPPs into $670. Play the SNG in pure survival mode, win a seat, unregister from the tourney, and then sell the T$s in the marketplace thread here. I had three offers to by the lot in less than two minutes at better than $0.98 on the dollar. With the WCOOP coming up, it's a sellers market right now.

[/ QUOTE ]

Or rather, just play a few hours of SnGs with the tourney money.

tehDiceman · #**1104** 08-27-2007, 04:25 AM

man the aggro monkey's were out in force tonight. i saw 3-4 villians with a standard PFR of .40 at 5NL.

variance: at the end of every session i always have one hand that destroys me. it is always right before im about to quit. normally it is a hand like AQ in position or mid PP or AK OOP. tonight i felt like it would be the hand to follow, literally 2 hands before my session was up. notice the PFR of .40 by the monkey in front of me. i said screw it and folded PF.

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.02/$0.05 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

SB: $9.44
BB: $2.90
UTG: $30.89
Hero (MP): $9.91
CO: $10.61
BTN: $13.09

Preflop: Hero is dealt 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8

(6 Players)
UTG raises to $0.40, 3 folds, SB calls $0.38, BB calls $0.35

Flop: ($1.20) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8

(3 Players)

kill me.

MusashiStyle · #**1105** 08-27-2007, 04:31 AM

hmmm... should be at nl50 soon, this time i intend to not play comme un retarde.

corsakh · #**1106** 08-27-2007, 04:42 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Call and let him hang himself.

[/ QUOTE ]
I on the other hand like to just get it in ... If nothing else, if discourages bluffing you

When against thinking players (which might not be the case here), I will play hardball with my marginal hands and hell if the pot is small, I will sometimes show down semi-garbage like buttom pair as long as it is only a slight mistake. (that is, I suspect to be slightly behing villians range but not crushed, so I might win an occasional showdown)

Gotta protect myself and make them think I'm not worth bluffing (a concept borrowed from Schneids limit Cardrunners vids)

But the above of course does no apply here, what applies here is that a lot of cards can scare both you an villian, so you want him sucked in while he shows interest (and your are ahead of his range btw)

[/ QUOTE ]

You want to push him off a bluff? I am missing to understand how can this be EV+.

Gelford · #**1107** 08-27-2007, 05:27 AM

[ QUOTE ]

You want to push him off a bluff? I am missing to understand how can this be EV+.

[/ QUOTE ]

There where two things that I stated above:
1. In generel I don't like to have people think they can bluff me and/or push me around, I want them to play straightforward.

That was a generel statement, and I discussed two measures that I take, first is to go bet/3bet on flops and the second was preventively showing down very marginal hands as long as pot was fairly small and the mistake therefore not major. These are NOT things that maximize EV in the current hand, but makes my session (and future sessions perhaps, if it is against regs) easier to play and thus imho maximizes my overall EV.

Now looking at this hand:
You are oop, and you get raised .... If villian has JJ+, then you are getting stacked no matter what.

If not, well ... he is showing interest and might just decide, that you are bluffing and call with his A5 88 AQ 78 or whatever.

Now if you just smooth call him and see the turn, the thing is you let him see a free card .. and you've decided already to commit, so what now ??

And A or a 7 comes, are you happy ... are you checkcalling ... you've decided to let him hang himself, so you are calling.

But you are oop, and if an A or 7 comes, are you sure you want to call a shove ?? (or a K or a Q)

Now what if an A or 7 hits and he just checks behind, then more scare cards appear (A K or a Q or a 8 or ... whatever) on river ... will you bet ? ... will you check ??

If you check, then he will bet his pair of Aces and just check behind if he was betting flop as a bluff and decided not to fire more barrels (or decided not to value bet his 88 anymore) and the 78s hand that might have called you on flop, decided to take a free card on turn and then either let go on river or charged you heavily.

If you like to play passively OOP, then be my guest, but without a read that says, villian is overaggro and prone to bluff several street, which I haven't noticed in this hand, I HATE playing passively OOP (at least postflop)

Back to you corsakh

corsakh · #**1108** 08-27-2007, 05:48 AM

For me its not about liking "to play passively OOP" or "my opponents playing straightforward".

For me its about EV situations. I prefer staying flexible.

If I find that being passive in this situation is more EV+ against this type of player, I put my "likings" aside.

You say you want your opponents to play straightforward? Well I certainly don't. Most players at this level suck balls. And when they try being tricky, they suck balls even more. If villains played ABC, 50NL would be much harder to beat. I want them to be tricky. I want them to bluff me with air. I want them to slowplay their sets. This is all hugely EV+ for me.

But I can see your point if you play 8 tables at a time and prefer keeping things simple [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Now regarding he hand. Knowing villains tendencies to bluff on paired board, I call the flop. I call pot on the turn. And sometimes, villain dependant, I call river push. And get shown A2s 8 out of 10.

If the flop was dryer, I check the flop and let him bluff all the way.

Gelford · #**1109** 08-27-2007, 05:59 AM

While you do a fine job of trying to act cool, note that my comment above in my first reply to this hand that talked about protecting yourself .... clearly says that it assumes thinking players!

And well I almost pulled SSNL balla rank against you, but decided not too, but well ... 50NL isn't the top of the ladder you know [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

MrWooster · #**1110** 08-27-2007, 06:11 AM

When will my turmoil stop?

Prima Network No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (6 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

saw flop|saw showdown

BB ($10.93)
UTG ($33.83)
MP ($11.97)
CO ($4.21)
Button ($4.97)
Hero ($10.91)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
2 folds, CO calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.55, BB raises to $11.03 (All-In), CO folds, Hero calls $10.41 (All-In).

Flop: ($22.09) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Turn: ($22.09) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($22.09) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: $22.09

Results in white below:
Hero has Ks Kd (one pair, kings).
BB has Ad As (one pair, aces).
Outcome: BB wins $22.08.

Prima Network No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (4 handed) Hand History converter Courtesy of PokerZion.com

saw flop|saw showdown

SB ($9.37)
Hero ($13.39)
UTG ($12.37)
Button ($9.19)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG raises to $0.2, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.8, UTG calls $0.60.

Flop: ($1.65) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $1.15, UTG calls $1.15.

Turn: ($3.95) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $1.5, UTG calls $1.50.

River: ($6.95) 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $3.07, UTG calls $3.07.

Final Pot: $10.02

Results in white below:
Hero has 9d 9s (one pair, nines).
UTG has 6c 6h (three of a kind, sixes).
Outcome: Hero wins $6.95. UTG wins $3.07.