Best Big Men to Ever Play the Game

[Victor]

"Edited to add: I don't recall many players at all being called the next "MJ, Wilt, Magic, Bird, etc." The few that I recall being hyped that much: Durant, Oden, Shaq, Lebron, Ewing." And the scouts continued to "hype" him when they saw him play and practice with the Blazers during his prime, so its not predraft hype."

assani, what was i thinking? of course players are never overrated before playing in the nba. my bad on that one.

[kidcolin]

while I think Assani is going a little overboard talking about Sabonis when he didn't spend his prime in the NBA, there's a lot of evidence to suggest he was pretty incredible. He did pretty damn well in the NBA for a big man who started at age 31. He couldn't play a lot of minutes due to his age/knees, but his per 40 stats are really good.

Not that it's a perfect metric or anything, but basketball-reference has a "most similar at age stat".

Sabonis:

31. Zydrunas Ilgauskas
32. Bob Lanier
33. David Robinson
34. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
35. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
36. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
38. Patrick Ewing

All but his rookie year he compared with a HoFer at the same age.

[Assani Fisher]

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"Edited to add: I don't recall many players at all being called the next "MJ, Wilt, Magic, Bird, etc." The few that I recall being hyped that much: Durant, Oden, Shaq, Lebron, Ewing." And the scouts continued to "hype" him when they saw him play and practice with the Blazers during his prime, so its not predraft hype."

assani, what was i thinking? of course players are never overrated before playing in the nba. my bad on that one.

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Victor, this is what you're not understanding....Sabonis was evaluated and praised on many occassions after playing against current NBA players. Yes some guys are overhyped, but not to this extent. Go re-read the article exerpts I posted...people don't say things like "nobody in the league can do what he does" or "he does things I've never seen before" or "hes better than Patrick Ewing(who was just as hyped as Oden is now) and would be drafted before him" for just any old player.

[Assani Fisher]

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while I think Assani is going a little overboard talking about Sabonis when he didn't spend his prime in the NBA,

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All I'm doing is posting quotes from other people....people that have seen him play a lot more than us.

[kidcolin]

I understand that Assani. It's just really hard to put him up there when he missed out on playing the best competition. From all I've read, and given how he handled himself in the NBA even way past his prime, I think he probably would've been an All Star center for most of his career.

[teamdonkey]

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Duncan is extremely underrated. We all love flash. So of course someone who plays boring and unimaginative basketball isn't going to be rated fairly. MEbenhoe, your career averages for both players ignore the fact that Robinson played in an era where 20 more points were scored per game.

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Robinson's best season was '93-'94 (29.8 ppg), when the league average was 101.5 ppg. Duncan's best season was 01'02 (25.5 ppg), when the league average was 95.5 ppg. So no, the difference wasn't 20, and no, Duncan's numbers aren't better than Robinson's when adjusted for era.

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thats 12.

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no, 101.5 - 95.5 = 6.

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I could pick other seasons and it'd be 20.

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no, you couldn't. You made that number up and even the two extremes don't work out close. The fact is, during Robinson's 14 years the league average was 99.5 ppg, and during Duncan's 10 years it's 95.6 ppg. A difference of four.

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Duncan causes his team to win moreso than Robinson. Bottom line.

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i never argued he didn't.

[teamdonkey]

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Duncan averages 21.8, 11.9, and 3.2. Hakeem averages 21.8, 11.1, and 2.5. And thats not even factoring in pace and era.

Hakeem's career PER is 23.6, Duncan's is 25.2.

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these numbers include Hakeem's last 6 years, where he was no where near as productive as the first 12. FWIW Hakeem's averages through his first 10 seasons are 23.5/12.5/3.6. If Duncan plays 8 more years (which he probably won't, no offense to him, an 18 year career is unreal) his overall numbers will dip well below Hakeem's.

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More titles despite having at best a similar cast over the coures of his career, better stats despite playing on a slower paced team and in a lower scoring era, more awards and honors, better PER....how can you say "i'm not sure how anyone can argue on Duncan's side"?

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comparing number of titles is a poor way to compare players, and especially here. Hakeem had to compete against the best player and the best team in NBA history, as well as another historically great team (Jazz), while Duncan has not. Stats are slightly in favor of Duncan because he's still in his peak. Comparing peak seasons or first 10 years and it's clear Hakeem's stats are better.

I'll say it again, Hakeem was better offensively and defensively, and it's not really that argueable.

[MEbenhoe]

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Comparing peak seasons or first 10 years and it's clear Hakeem's stats are better.

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And again, against much better players than Duncan has had to face.

[Chuck D]

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Comparing peak seasons or first 10 years and it's clear Hakeem's stats are better.

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And again, against much better players than Duncan has had to face.

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but its fun to use someones all peak vs someone else's peak+decline when you are trying to support the former's case

[teamdonkey]

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Duncan averages 21.8, 11.9, and 3.2. Hakeem averages 21.8, 11.1, and 2.5. And thats not even factoring in pace and era.

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and WTF, you switched their blocks per game? interesting that the one favoring Hakeem was the one you messed up.