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#91
01-07-2007, 08:37 PM
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Re: HOLY COW
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Wow, there is an awful lot of "old guy" stereotyping in this thread. Just because the guy is over 50 doesnt mean hes a nit, just like not all 22 y.o. with backward baseball caps are aggressive bad ass players. It sounds like this kind of thinking may in fact may have played a significant part of a questionable laydown here. [/ QUOTE ] shut up old man [/ QUOTE ] I LOLed. 
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#92
01-07-2007, 08:40 PM
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Re: HOLY COW
[ QUOTE ]
Wow, there is an awful lot of "old guy" stereotyping in this thread. Just because the guy is over 50 doesnt mean hes a nit, just like not all 22 y.o. with backward baseball caps are aggressive bad ass players. It sounds like this kind of thinking may in fact may have played a significant part of a questionable laydown here. [/ QUOTE ] i'm pretty sure if you don't use stereotypes at all you're missing out on a lot of information
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#95
01-08-2007, 01:08 PM
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Re: HOLY COW
from my pov this wouldve been a call and this applies to many of us from here.
but from steve's point of view this is a fold and here are the reasons why: 1. he is against an old man, shaking like mad NOT KNOWING WHAT THAT MEANS 2. he is covered so his tourney life is in stake 3. if he folds, he still has a ton of chips left to play with with those blinds 4. fold was +EV from his POV just because HE KNOWS HE IS BETTER than most of everyone else there, and he will HAVE enough chips to play with and get them back and it wasnt worth the busto with the 4th nuts on that board. For who says it was a bad fold, yeah, for us who DONT have that much confidence and still have a lot to learn, but that is what makes us different from each other, at least me from steve, he is better and he knows it and mostly he is confident in his play which means that remaning stack CAN BE USED better than i could. pretty much what i wanted to say was that from a very good player's POV who knows where he stand in a field of people, this was +EV. for an average to good player this was a bad fold because it was an "OMG DOUBLE UP" chance. cheers and LOTS OF LUCK there guys! later edit: just saw steve got to be CL, so that stands my point more. GRATS man and GL to you and the rest of the 2+2ers there
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#96
01-08-2007, 08:57 PM
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Re: HOLY COW
[ QUOTE ]
He checks, I bet 2100, and he starts shaking and eventually makes it 9k. [/ QUOTE ] That... really seems like he just decided to run a huge bluff. Whoever quoted Mike Caro got it right. You didn't notice any super shaking/nervousness on the flop or turn before this point, and assuming you were still paying a lot of attention to him, he probably didn't get nervous until he ran this huge bluff. The river wasn't an instashove of 60k, but rather he considered 20, then decided 60 was the real deal. If he snap-shoved 60k I might like the fold a little more, but this information right here is more consistent with a bluff than a monster. And if he was bluff raising the turn (it was a big raise, and a boat would try to keep a draw in the hand), he certainly wouldn't be giving up on the perfect river bluff card now would he? It's also not a bad rule of thumb to not make folds this big at points like this in tournaments like this. The pressure makes people do crazy things, and if you get cold decked you get cold decked. If you were deeper stacked or battling as chip leaders maybe it would be different, but talking yourself into extreme plays is probably -EV in tournaments. Overall strategy is more important than making a huge play on one particular hand. Everett
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