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#1
11-30-2007, 06:58 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
why not call and if you spike an A or K he stacks anyways. seems to be a waste to shove. [/ QUOTE ] You flop an ace or king only 33% of the time. What's your plan the other 66%? Not 4betting here is so gross. 
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#2
11-30-2007, 07:18 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
Okay, so say we 4B pre-flop, and he calls (I'm gonna ignore the more obvious case of if he 5 bets pre-flop since we just get it all in there), what do we do on the flop if we don't hit? Do we call him down, likely having to get it all in to get to showdown? Do we get it all in if checked to?
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#3
11-30-2007, 08:15 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
Okay, so say we 4B pre-flop, and he calls (I'm gonna ignore the more obvious case of if he 5 bets pre-flop since we just get it all in there), what do we do on the flop if we don't hit? Do we call him down, likely having to get it all in to get to showdown? Do we get it all in if checked to? [/ QUOTE ] this is pretty much what im saying. if we 4 bet here, i would rather just 4 bet shove.
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#4
11-30-2007, 08:50 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] why not call and if you spike an A or K he stacks anyways. seems to be a waste to shove. [/ QUOTE ] You flop an ace or king only 33% of the time. What's your plan the other 66%? Not 4betting here is so gross. [/ QUOTE ] That sounds so horrible. Your strategy is basically to play pre-flop poker against an opponent whose flaw is playing badly after the flop. Against this opponent, you want to see flops and decide on the flop if you want to call him down or not.
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#5
11-30-2007, 09:03 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] why not call and if you spike an A or K he stacks anyways. seems to be a waste to shove. [/ QUOTE ] You flop an ace or king only 33% of the time. What's your plan the other 66%? Not 4betting here is so gross. [/ QUOTE ] That sounds so horrible. Your strategy is basically to play pre-flop poker against an opponent whose flaw is playing badly after the flop. Against this opponent, you want to see flops and decide on the flop if you want to call him down or not. [/ QUOTE ] Uh...no. You are advocating sacrificing a 2:1 edge preflop because you hope that you can get an even bigger post-flop edge. That's a huge sacrifice. This is one hand. It doesn't define our strategy. You have a tremendous edge on this hand pre-flop that you can't sacrifice. But I wouldn't want to get all-in pre-flop with 77 even though it is ahead of his range, because then my edge is small. See what I'm getting at? Completely ignoring pre-flop equity just because you have a post-flop edge (even a big one) is pretty bad. Especially vs. a guy like this where you don't even need to worry about balancing your 4-bet ranges. Stick to premiums because he's never folding anyway.
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#7
11-30-2007, 09:56 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
You are advocating sacrificing a 2:1 edge preflop because you hope that you can get an even bigger post-flop edge. [/ QUOTE ] Please, show me where we have a 2:1 edge preflop here.
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#8
11-30-2007, 09:29 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
I have seen more of these types of players and have the same question. The mistake I have been making is trying to get at their money before they lose it all as you stated. Playing hard preflop with AK is always a flip. Against this type of opponent I think ABC poker is the only profitable 'strategy'. He sees all your bets as bluffs so don't bluff, the truth is soooo hard to believe.
If you have more discipline/skill then flipping is bad imo against a maniac/drunk. He plays bad post flop therefore play well postflop. It really is that simple.
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#9
11-30-2007, 09:32 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
That's a huge sacrifice. This is one hand. It doesn't define our strategy. You have a tremendous edge on this hand pre-flop that you can't sacrifice.
But I wouldn't want to get all-in pre-flop with 77 even though it is ahead of his range, because then my edge is small. See what I'm getting at? Uhhh... so AK is better than 77 because....?
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#10
11-30-2007, 10:19 PM
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Re: How do you like to play against maniacs like this??
[ QUOTE ]
That's a huge sacrifice. This is one hand. It doesn't define our strategy. You have a tremendous edge on this hand pre-flop that you can't sacrifice. But I wouldn't want to get all-in pre-flop with 77 even though it is ahead of his range, because then my edge is small. See what I'm getting at? Uhhh... so AK is better than 77 because....? [/ QUOTE ] Dude, if you're going to be snide, you should try to be right. Seriously? Assume his range is wide. Vs. a wide range, AK is a big favorite. Vs. a wide range, 77 is only a marginal favorite. If his range is wide, AK dominates far more hands than 77, and is dominated by far fewer hands than 77. I really have to spell this out? If you get all in and he flips over AJ (or KQ, or AQ, or QJ), which would you rather have, AK or 77? How about if he flips QQ or KK? Which one you want now? Before you point out AA, I say, a) wtf cares if you have 77 or AK vs. that hand and b) We have an A, so AA is less likely So, 300BBs deep this is kind of sick, since I did not notice that OP says he doesn't 3-bet light. But irrespective of this, I wasn't arguing whether to get all-in here, I was arguing against the general sentiment that you shouldn't worry about pre-flop edges vs. this guy simply because he sucks post-flop. Pre-flop edges can still matter a lot.
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