need a plan vs a 2+2er

[nazahl]

alright, so were not really sold on any flop line. I went with check/call pretty much b/c I only see worse hands folding or me getting shoved on getting it in as a slight favorite or a fairly bad dog, neither really help the situation much.

Full Tilt Poker, $1/$2 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

SB: $201
Hero (BB): $256.15
UTG: $189
CO: $248.35
BTN: $203

Pre-Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BB)
UTG folds, <font color="red">CO raises to $8</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $27</font>, CO calls $19

Flop: ($55) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">CO bets $38</font>, Hero calls $38

Turn: ($131) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)

what now?

[gjim]

Neat hand.

I like check calling the flop some percentage of the time, but I probably would bet fold the flop the majority of the time.

I think this potsize makes playing turn kind of awkward. Leading turns your hand face up, but its probably the best way to get all the money in. There are a bunch of hands drawing to boats and two flush draws in his range bc of the flop check so I'd lead for like $50, or maybe $45. For value and to try and induce a shove.

[Paul Thomson]

bet $50.

[Nick Royale]

[ QUOTE ]
bet $50.

[/ QUOTE ]
We shouldn't give him like 4:1 direct, 9:1 implied on this board. At least 80 imo.

I realise you're trying to induce but I don't like it on this board and I don't think it will work often enough.

[willw9]

O this is against me. Hehe..

[willw9]

I think the real question in this hand is the river. I called the turn, another 9 hit the river, and you shoved. I think this is a fairly easy c/f against not just me, but anybody with a brain really. What do you expect to get value from? I dunno, with my hand the turn was exactly a call, but I did put you squarely on JJ without much thought. I/anybody could have soo many boats though on that river, given my line. Like I think it's fair to say I could have every possibly boat combo on that river. A shove gets value from one hand (exactly my hand, like exactly) if the villain is dumb (but I ain't dumb yo).

<font color="white">I had 76cc if you haven't guessed already.</font>

[forhasta]

Doesn't check-calling on the flop just scream JJ ??? A reraise preflop followed by being scared by an overcard on the flop?

I like Nick Royale's analysis - If we bet the flop we disguise our hand as well as getting some FE.

Now, let's say the turn blanks and you bet flop and were called. What's your action ?

[Bramsterdam]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the real question in this hand is the river. I called the turn, another 9 hit the river, and you shoved. I think this is a fairly easy c/f against not just me, but anybody with a brain really. What do you expect to get value from?

[/ QUOTE ]So why did you call then?

[willw9]

Um I didn't...

[BGnight]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the real question in this hand is the river. I called the turn, another 9 hit the river, and you shoved. I think this is a fairly easy c/f against not just me, but anybody with a brain really. What do you expect to get value from? I dunno, with my hand the turn was exactly a call, but I did put you squarely on JJ without much thought. I/anybody could have soo many boats though on that river, given my line. Like I think it's fair to say I could have every possibly boat combo on that river. A shove gets value from one hand (exactly my hand, like exactly) if the villain is dumb (but I ain't dumb yo).

<font color="white">I had 76cc if you haven't guessed already.</font>

[/ QUOTE ]

How much did he bet on turn that would allow him to c/fold river? I just don't see what he could bet that would not commit him to river no matter what. To say river is an easy c/fold is kinda silly. c/call yes, but he can never fold river if he bets turn.