Do you want to have children?

[CommanderCorm]

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The impact a child has on their life is so big that they have to convince themselves that it is the greatest thing in the world to justify it.

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I´m pretty sure he´s saying they don´t "have to convince themselves".

[Henry17]

The inability to see that parenthood is a choice with pros and cons and that some people might view the cons as greater than the pros is indicative of irrational behaviour similar to that found in religious fanatics and cults. They have self-deluded themselves to make their situation work.

[CommanderCorm]

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The inability to see that parenthood is a choice with pros and cons and that some people might view the cons as greater than the pros is indicative of irrational behaviour similar to that found in religious fanatics and cults.

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Of course they are irrational. The reason they put up with all the work and duties that come along with children is because they really really love them, and love is usually not a rational feeling. The same reason causes them to try and convince you that their children are a greater good for them than the "freedom" they would enjoy without them.

There´s no reason for you to think most of them are "talking themselves" into that feeling, though. It´s pretty clear that it is in the nature of parenthood to be in love with ones children.

[RoundGuy]

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They have self-deluded themselves to make their situation work.

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Isn't it strange then that not one single parent has said they regret having children in this thread? Not one.

That means that EVERY SINGLE PARENT is delusional, or you're just talking out of your ass.

I choose the latter.

[qwnu]

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They have self-deluded themselves to make their situation work.

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Isn't it strange then that not one single parent has said they regret having children in this thread? Not one.

That means that EVERY SINGLE PARENT is delusional, or you're just talking out of your ass.

I choose the latter.

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I'm surprised nobody has mentioned it, but Ann Landers famously found that 70% of parents who responded to her question would not have children if they could make the decision again.

The column (from the '70s) is reprinted here on this "childfree" site.

Obviously this is somewhat dated, and not scientific, but it does demonstrate that the lack of regret you think is universal is not.

It's true that this example is used in at least one textbook as an example of an unreliable self-selected sample, but the same text says a scientific survey found that 91% of parents would have kids again. Quite a difference, but at the same time, 91% is not 100%. That's nearly 1 in 10 parents who have the regrets you are ignoring.

I'd be interested in finding similar "regret" stats for people who choose not to have children.

BTW, you seem to have changed your tune in this thread. Earlier, you said you don't think those who choose childlessness are defective, but you hope they don't later have regrets. Now, you declare that Henry has willfully refused to "see the light" as you see it, and is therefore selfish.

There's a recent politics thread titled "what's wrong with america (7 words or less)". My submission was "Everyone thinks his opinions should be mine." Seems apt in this situation. Childfree couples merely want to have their choice be acknowledged as reasonable and worthy of respect. Some parents want to have their choice acknowledged as correct.

[BDaws]

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Isn't it strange then that not one single parent has said they regret having children in this thread? Not one.

That means that EVERY SINGLE PARENT is delusional, or you're just talking out of your ass.

I choose the latter.

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Isn't there some middle ground? Certainly some parents could be delusional, convincing themselves that having kids was the best thing that ever happened to them, and some could genuinely feel that way, right?

Henry wins this thread. Just because you love your kids doesn't mean everyone else needs to have kids. That's just retarded.

[Ghazban]

I can't imagine any parent publically stating that they regret having children whether they feel that way or not...


Edit: I mean, really, unless you absolutely hate that you had kids, you probably wouldn't say anything. If you felt that havings kids was, overall, a mistake but you still cared for your children, I doubt you'd post your feeling that you'd rather you hadn't had them in a public forum. Kids read the internet (shocking!) too.

[Ser William]

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Henry wins this thread. Just because you love your kids doesn't mean everyone else needs to have kids. That's just retarded.

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I suggest you actually read the thread then. No parent has chimed in saying that you NEED to have kids. Henry asked for reasons why people would want to have kids and he was given them. But the parents on this thread often have encouraged him NOT to have kids. I'm sure there are some parents that would force kids on everyone and that IS retarded, yes. But the majority of sane parents realize that having kids is not for everyone.

That should have been the end of the thread. Unfortunately, Henry seems to think that his way is the only way, and hence continues what some might consider trolling.

[Henry17]

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That should have been the end of the thread. Unfortunately, Henry seems to think that his way is the only way, and hence continues what some might consider trolling.

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Actually that isn't true at all. Have you been reading the same thread?

My position has been from the outset that it is an individual choice. What I have taken offence to is the implication that my agency is defective because I don't want children. I've been told I'll change my mind, that I'll regret my choice, that something will be missing, that I'm selfish, that my life is empty, that I can't possibly understand etc.

All I've stated is that for me the benefits of parenthood are not worth having a boring life. There is no claim that other people should have the same values. Individual's conception of the good are private and specific to them. I have no business judging them or telling them what their conception of the good should be.

[revots33]

I do agree with Henry that a lot of parents have a prejudice (sometimes subtle, sometimes not) against people who choose not to have children. They usually categorize them as selfish, self-involved, living lives devoid of real meaning, etc. (and yes a few of these words have appeared in some of the parents' responses on this very thread). Many non-parents devote a large part of their their lives to helping others. And many parents are selfish [censored]. Parents don't have a monopoly on selflessness or the ability to love.

My issue with Henry is that he keeps asking parents to justify why they think having kids is so great, as if it can be quantified. "Because I love my children" is a perfectly sufficient answer IMO.

To each his own.