The Well: TOO EAZY!

[mce86]

Which part of NL do you think is more important:
a) preflop
B) flop
c)post flop
and why?

[too eazy]

[ QUOTE ]
Which part of NL do you think is more important:
a) preflop
B) flop
c)post flop
and why?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the most important part of NL is overall discipline and focus at the tables. I think River play is what seperates the good from the great.

[ActionStan]

Worst river transgression:
- missing value bets
- not laying down 2nd best hands
- not taking away enough pots
- all of the above

Also, you mentioned somewhere that 6-max players tend to play better post flop. Is there a particular skill that 6-max brings out that isn't developed in full ring or is it that the level of skill post-flop is simply higher in 6-max?

[GrandMelon]

what are my leaks?
who are you up the most against?
plan on moving up as high as you can or will you be content staying at mid stakes and making a nice hourly?

[too eazy]

[ QUOTE ]
what are my leaks?
who are you up the most against?
plan on moving up as high as you can or will you be content staying at mid stakes and making a nice hourly?

[/ QUOTE ]

I am up the most against TheMini0n.

I don't plan on ever playing higher than 5/10, I don't chase dreams. (This is much the same reason I don't play MTT). I'm also well aware that my edge would be minimal if not non-existant even with practice in these games. I'm not sure I have the mental/emotional aptitude to develop into a player who beats 2knl+, Despite what some people who may or may not be trying to level me say.

Your leaks? You don't have any [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Eh, ok I won't be a dbag about it. I've done a good job avoiding playing with you and generally we normally play at different times as I'm an early AM player, but in limited experience I would say you play me better than just about anyone else, and there really isn't anything significant worth mentioning. In fact I think you have the best positional play out of anyone I've played with which was kind of shocking. I can't believe EPiPPeN or whatever actually believes you are "terrible." Really wish I could say something and not look like an ass kisser but I'm at a loss for leaks in your game unfortunately. Probably means I'm outclassed but then again I think we only have 3k ish hands on each other at most.

[ActionStan]

...snip...
People "get it" at different rates. It's about discipline and focus as well as being honest with yourself. This isn't for everyone. 3-4/hrs a day should get you 100k a year if you start at 25nl and you really study hard in my opinion. Barring some mega horrible run. The mid stakes games are easy. I don't think games get greatly difficult if you're properly bankrolled until 10/20+. There are plenty of breakeven players and donators at 2/4-5/10 to pick on. I don't expect this to ever change either. A big realization I think a lot of players don't really come across is how bad a "good" .5/1 player really is.
...snip...

- biggest epiphany when you "got" somthing

- It is your contention (and I'm inclined to believe you) that most players up to .5/1 suck, many players from 2/4-5/10 suck. What do you look for in these sucky players when you are sitting down and choosing a juicy table. Any/all of:
- playing out of position too much
- folding too much in big pots
- paying off in pos
- paying off oop
- limp/calling
- passive and predictable
- too loose
- too tight
- other

[jlp_2908]

When you mention study can you elaborate?? I daily go over a few hands and usually post interesting ones on here as well as critique others hands around my level. I also read somewhat; I read 3 poker books (Playboy poker book, Theory of Poker, and Negreunus Book), a monthly poker magazine, and pretty much everything on here that pertains to me(the monthly issues and most of the posts in Full Ring) To be honest i didnt really get much out of the books except some insight and a basic understanding of the game. I really tried to absorb all the material...But they were more geared towards limit except Negreunus book, which was surprisingly insightful, I liked it. Also I review graphs bb/100 to mark my progress. See which hands are profitable from which position etc.
Are there any other methods you reccommend for "studying"? I mean the way Im doin it now doesnt seem "hard" like studying "hard" for an exam would be.

How did you go about studying?
Sorry if its a dumb question

[too eazy]

[ QUOTE ]

- biggest epiphany when you "got" somthing


[/ QUOTE ]

hmm, good question. there were a few pretty groundbreaking (at the time) epiphanies i've had in my short "career." one of the biggest ones is that the game does not dramatically change just because you moved up one level. the subtleties that differentiate a good 2/4 reg from a good 3/6 reg are just that, subtleties, and it's important to not try and implement a massive overhaul of your game just becuase you are moving up in levels. you should just focus on playing your personal solid game and let the adjustments you make come "subconsciously" based off your reads on the new player pool (hope that makes sense, cause it was a huge one for me and something i think holds players back from successfully transitioning to a new level)

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

- It is your contention (and I'm inclined to believe you) that most players up to .5/1 suck, many players from 2/4-5/10 suck. What do you look for in these sucky players when you are sitting down and choosing a juicy table. Any/all of:
- playing out of position too much
- folding too much in big pots
- paying off in pos
- paying off oop
- limp/calling
- passive and predictable
- too loose
- too tight
- other

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to sound like a prick, but these are basically all of the things I look for. You essentially hit the nail on the head here. In a full ring game I'm looking for players who generally have >25vpip or <15vpip because these are the ones that usually make their tendencies most readily clear. Finding ways to pick on the standard 15/10's is the hard part as they're often capable of adjustments more so than players at the other extremes. However, these players with solid looking stats still generally do have at least one of the leaks described above (as do us all), and it's a focus of mine to decipher which one of these leaks they do possess when I'm logging hands.

Nice question Stan, What limits/games do you play? Sounds like you've got a bit of experience or a lot of aptitude, one of the two.

[too eazy]

[ QUOTE ]
Worst river transgression:
- missing value bets
- not laying down 2nd best hands
- not taking away enough pots
- all of the above

Also, you mentioned somewhere that 6-max players tend to play better post flop. Is there a particular skill that 6-max brings out that isn't developed in full ring or is it that the level of skill post-flop is simply higher in 6-max?

[/ QUOTE ]

For me my worst river transgression is DEFINITELY missing value bets. I over-estimate the aggression of my opponents sometimes and try to pick off too many river bluffs by going for c/c's. I also from time to time underestimate the ability for my opponents to call 3 barrels which is definitely more common for me than average as I generally find I frustrate tables and make my presence known as a loose/aggressive player post flop rather quickly.

The reason 6m players are better post flop is simple logic: They play more heads up pots postflop more often with more marginal holdings.