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#21
11-03-2007, 10:31 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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[ QUOTE ] I'm genuinely curious about this. When you make a post like the above - do you choose your words to make the concepts you are trying to convey as simple and as clear as possible to the reader? Or do you have some other criteria for choosing them? [/ QUOTE ] Huh? [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img] [/ QUOTE ] What made you choose the words you did when trying to convey whatever idea or concept it was you were trying to convey? Were they chosen based on clarity and ease of understanding for the reader or something else? 
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#22
11-03-2007, 11:06 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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I read this thread title as "retracting" instead of restating. I can only hope. [/ QUOTE ] Well, he's switched to merely dealing with the "adjustment period", rather trivial, rather than claiming something more universal and innate in a large portion of humans. Yawn. luckyme
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#23
11-03-2007, 11:12 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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Besides, there are plenty more countries beside Sweden with high atheist numbers and high happiness ratings. I linked the info in the other thread. [/ QUOTE ] If they're so happy, why aren't they able to reproduce at replacement levels? No one seems to have a reasonable answer for this. From a Darwinian point of view, a happy (fit, successful) species makes lots of offspring. What's going on with these high % atheist countries?
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#24
11-03-2007, 11:20 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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Am I naive to believe that a number of people, if told tomorrow 'There is 100% NO GOD - here's the proof', would suddenly see things like rape, murder, theft, robbery etc. acceptable? I am not saying I agree or disagree with OP, just trying to add something that seems to be always forgoten in these conversations. And I am not only talking about devout believers here. There is a MASSIVE difference between non-belief in god, (and in the ramifications therin implied with regard to everlasting punishment/reward etc,) and knowing for a fact there is no god. [/ QUOTE ] I see some really awful possibilities resulting from removing God across the board. Life would likely get worse for everyone. The higher % of church attendees in my neighborhood, the safer my person and property.
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#25
11-03-2007, 11:23 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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What made you choose the words you did when trying to convey whatever idea or concept it was you were trying to convey? Were they chosen based on clarity and ease of understanding for the reader or something else? [/ QUOTE ] Best I can say is "painting a picture". In this case, obviously not "mechanical" but from my perspective there is an internal logic which connects the parts and pieces but if done properly, the "tone" of the piece is the expression of its origin. In no way am I associating myself with him but a "flow of consciousness" by some like James Joyce comes to mind. After your question I tried to find a piece by Gurdjieff in which he describes a large two story ship on a river with many passengers and the events forthcoming. Before he presents the piece he tells the reader that "pictures" of what is happening will rise in the readers consciousness of the whole episode. The whole episode is experienced in "imaginative pictures" with great clarity. I was truly amazed that he could do this and he did. Quite a piece, truly amazing. Aside from that the question arises, "from whence do your words come from". Not written on a paper of our mind. Seeking the solution to a mathematical problem is similar for at some point a "eureka" point is reached. the question is again"from whence does the "eureka" come from? On and on and on...
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#26
11-03-2007, 11:25 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
Karl Marx whose famous quote, "religion is the opium of the people", proposed that religion provides people with the following:
1. a sense of purpose and meaning 2. an activity designed to encourage social cohesion 3. a framework of rules designed as a form of social control. Although religion has been used as a reason for much violence and oppression, I agree that it does serve a useful purpose in today's social climate.
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#27
11-03-2007, 11:32 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
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[ QUOTE ] Besides, there are plenty more countries beside Sweden with high atheist numbers and high happiness ratings. I linked the info in the other thread. [/ QUOTE ] If they're so happy, why aren't they able to reproduce at replacement levels? No one seems to have a reasonable answer for this. From a Darwinian point of view, a happy (fit, successful) species makes lots of offspring. What's going on with these high % atheist countries? [/ QUOTE ] Yes, those Africans are having a ball in good old Africa...  You can't think of any reasons? For real? 1. Dumb people have more kids. That's fact. Dumb people are also more likely to be religious 2. Many churches shun birth control - the Catholics with over a billion members, forbid it. No birth control = heaps more kids, obviously 3. Religion actually teaches people to multiply. Having heaps of kids is considered a good thing. (Another one of the evils of religion as the world approaches overpopulation).
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#28
11-03-2007, 11:46 PM
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Re: Restating My \"Religion Does Good\" Post More Explicitly
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Besides, there are plenty more countries beside Sweden with high atheist numbers and high happiness ratings. I linked the info in the other thread. [/ QUOTE ] If they're so happy, why aren't they able to reproduce at replacement levels? No one seems to have a reasonable answer for this. From a Darwinian point of view, a happy (fit, successful) species makes lots of offspring. What's going on with these high % atheist countries? [/ QUOTE ] Yes, those Africans are having a ball in good old Africa... You can't think of any reasons? For real? 1. Dumb people have more kids. That's fact. Dumb people are also more likely to be religious 2. Many churches shun birth control - the Catholics with over a billion members, forbid it. No birth control = heaps more kids, obviously 3. Religion actually teaches people to multiply. Having heaps of kids is considered a good thing. (Another one of the evils of religion as the world approaches overpopulation). [/ QUOTE ] This is essentially a dodge. If we're interested in Western countries, and I am, it's difficult to find the secular society that is breeding at replacement. Ireland is the European champ with a 1st class economy, high church attendence and a solid birthrate. Compare that to Spain or Italy (talk about Catholic!), not Nigeria. There's something in it that makes the atheists understandably uncomfortable. When a cohort is not reproducing, something is amiss. It's easy to say that the cohort is 'too smart' to reproduce but I'm sure you can see how lame that sounds. My own guess is that the cohort is too selfish to reproduce.
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