Stupid preflop decision vs DeathDonkey

[ragazzobello]

I think the decision is so close that it merits metagame considerations. If the fish and DD notice that you're folding in the face of this kind of action, then you could be inviting the fish to play back at you even more, which would be a total disaster in a short game where he is playing passively to begin with. You also could be inviting DD to start liberally trying to raise you out of the pot preflop and isolate the fish which would force you into some tougher preflop decisions.

Calling has too many positives for it to be a clear mistake. 1) you have a protected pot v. DD 2) you have the button 3)you're highly unlikely to be dominated 4) you're hand is relatively disguised and you will likley get paid off if you make two pair of better. 5) you could easily be up against two hands that have overlapping overcards and scoop a 9 or 7 high board. 6)you're suited in a multiway pot

[daryn]

highly unlikely to be dominated?

99-AA dominates 97s

[Joe Tall]

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I think the decision is so close that it merits metagame considerations. If the fish and DD notice that you're folding in the face of this kind of action, then you could be inviting the fish to play back at you even more, which would be a total disaster in a short game where he is playing passively to begin with. You also could be inviting DD to start liberally trying to raise you out of the pot preflop and isolate the fish which would force you into some tougher preflop decisions.



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This wasn't one of those situations, I was aware of it as well as DD which he agreed. Actually, I prefaced all discussion with, "all meta-game situation are not in play in this hand", DD agreed fully.

[Bakes]

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only reason i might fold is cuz deathdonkey runs really good, other wise id call for sure, i once raised pocket 7s and folded for one more bet to his 79s(that he 3-bet my EMP raise with btw, for anyone actually considering folding here) and felt pretty good about it, especially he showed his cards confirming my expert laydown

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good read newhizzle

[Paluka]

I almost always call here, and I always feel good about it later. The only thing that would make me fold is if the small blind has such a tight range that I expect that he would cap given that he 3 bet me.
I really don't like capping here preflop at all. Taking control of the hand doesn't excite me much when one of my opponents is loose and passive.

[emerson]

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Live 50/100 at Rio, 4 handed. DD, two super fish and me.

I open on the button with 97s, SB who is super loose but passive preflop 3 bets, DeathDonkey 4 bets in the big blind.

Call or fold? How close?

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Call. You are in for half and will be getting 13 to 1 to call one bet on the flop, giving you odds to draw on lots of partial hits. There will be enough money in the pot to keep opponents in and paying you off if you hit strong. You need to see the flop.

If the BB gets you to fold here it is a major victory. He'll have position on a weak player with your dead money in the pot.

[12ressiMorP]

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Live 50/100 at Rio, 4 handed. DD, two super fish and me.

I open on the button with 97s, SB who is super loose but passive preflop 3 bets, DeathDonkey 4 bets in the big blind.

Call or fold? How close?

[/ QUOTE ]

Call. You are in for half and will be getting 13 to 1 to call one bet on the flop

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What % is it 2 bets to us on the flop if we just call preflop here? If we cap?

[vmacosta]

why is it that all these great poker minds are wasting their time bickering about such an unimportant little pf decision?

btw i vote call but i am looser than most.

[James282]

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why is it that all these great poker minds are wasting their time bickering about such an unimportant little pf decision?

btw i vote call but i am looser than most.

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Because little decisions like this are the only ones remotely worth discussing. I think I probably dump it. Also, mike, talking about those of you who 'primarily play live' isn't especially worthwhile because I can't imagine how this could be a live vs. online decision. I mean sure, you get better reads postflop and maybe pay off less when you are behind, but even online players pick up reads vs. guys like this when playing live, and the difference between what you see vs. a guy like this and what i see can't be all that much different.

I think ultimately this decision is so close that it's probably not worth discussing tooooo much, but now that I've typed this whole post, I think that in a vaccuum it's a fold, but there are certain table conditions where it would be a call(most notably if there are players who would become more likely to attack what will ultimately give you a weak/nit/unstandard folding type image).

James

James

[mike l.]

great live players know their opponents much much better in general and sometimes so well theyre really in their heads. when chris posts what he had and why he 4 bet you will all see that that was the case here. joe needed to recognize that and make the right play which was call or even raise.

with online hands the question is "what would you do?"
with live hands the question is "what should i do?"

you would fold. but that's meaningless.
*he* should have called.