Easy call?

[shaundeeb]

Ok I def instacall, you are right this isn't the best board and action for TP/TK but they can easily have many hands you beat and have to win your 2 to 1 favorite vs his J10 etc.

If you aren't instacalling his shove and getting it in on this flop then check the flop. I don't mind a flop check in a usually wa/rarelybehind type of hand. You aren't afraid of that many turn cards and all but a 9 give you a few more outs to an even stronger hand etc.

he def can showup with AQ QJ K10 etc esp if you said standard players are bad here. Don't bet this flop with this hand if you plan on folding the flop or any point really unless board runs out J9 or 109 etc

[dxu05]

Not an easy call; in fact a very nasty call. Even the biggest, weirdest donks, don't open shove AQ, Q10, the garbage etc. They usually will call all ins with such junk, but never checkrepop.

The range here is J10(unlikely), sets, and KQ. You are a majority of the time doing yourself a favor by folding this against even moderately TAG players. Obviously, if the donk got there by pushing previously with absolute trash, then call. Since no real reads were attached, and I assume you would notice if he made all his chips by checkraising all in to bluff on the flop, this is a fold.

[sapsuckah]

[ QUOTE ]
If you aren't instacalling his shove and getting it in on this flop then check the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Shaun (and all)... can we discuss this concept a bit? I think this is an area I'd like to understand better because I think it's a big leak for me.

My problem lies in differentiating between the situations where this concept applies and where leading out may be appropriate even if you're planning to fold to a push. I could see making a $2k c-bet here with a hand like TT and folding to resistance.

And against bad players (which is what I'm used to since I generally play $8 - $12 tourneys), I'd be leading this flop for value and expect calls from mid pairs, AQ, Kx, JT, and often even A-high with no part of the board. So I could see it being profitable over time to lead out this flop even if I'm folding to a push.

So I'd appreciate it if you could offer some guidelines for when the concept of not-leading-when-you're-not-gonna-call-a-push applies vs when it's ok to bet/fold. Buyin considerations? Position? Stack sizes? What to look for in flop texture? etc...

Thanks!

Matt

[LottaNirvana]

[ QUOTE ]
Ok I def instacall, you are right this isn't the best board and action for TP/TK but they can easily have many hands you beat and have to win your 2 to 1 favorite vs his J10 etc.

If you aren't instacalling his shove and getting it in on this flop then check the flop. I don't mind a flop check in a usually wa/rarelybehind type of hand. You aren't afraid of that many turn cards and all but a 9 give you a few more outs to an even stronger hand etc.

he def can showup with AQ QJ K10 etc esp if you said standard players are bad here. Don't bet this flop with this hand if you plan on folding the flop or any point really unless board runs out J9 or 109 etc

[/ QUOTE ]

I was about to post my own reply, but this says it all.

[benlj21]

I think this is a pretty easy call once you bet the flop. That said, I don't mind checking here. This is pretty much WA/WB but I think villain pushes plenty of worse hands. I think if he shows up with KQ here you're going to get him in the long run. That said, I guess he could have AA-QQ but if that's the case I think the whole hand is kind of a cooler and he probably would have just busted you anyway if he would have rr'ed preflop. I don't think you should overthink this one too much, I'd just bet/call the flop.

[the alex]

Ewww...

Check the flop if you're contemplating a fold, but I'm more likely checking KJ here while playing AK like AA here- for stacks.