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Old 07-07-2007, 10:08 PM
ChipLeader ChipLeader is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 285
Default Where ICM is lacking?

A lot of people read (and flamed) my post yesterday about preflop decisions on the bubble of STTs in low stakes touraments. I was told by many to look into and research ICM, which I gladly did (including reading a post by INSTA or something earlier today that has drifted into later pages and i fear wont be coming back.)

First, before anybody gets the wrong idea, i think ICM is an invaluable tool to understand. Do not think I am discrediting it.

I do however, see a few potential problems in a 4 handed situation. Either I dont understand the concept completely correctly yet or there are a few flaws.

A.) Skill is totally negated
If you think you are significantly better than the other 3 players, or have some very solid reads, I feel you can exploit them better making raises and playing poker rather than deciding whether between only 2 plays.

B.) Constantly putting YOURSELF in the line of fire
While it may be a +EV push, taking all these small edges forces you to be the one constantly risking your stack. If I was in a situation where 3 other players were pushing preflops back and forth constantly, i would simply sit back waiting for a monster or til one of them beats another.

C.) Giving up better spots
I think this is my biggest problem with it. As Sklansky said in I forget which book, probably TOP, "A good bet is NOT a good bet if it prevents you from taking a better one later." Pushing because a play is +EV now is still not correct if it means risking a stack now when you can do it later with a better EV.

I think all of these points kinda blend together in ways, but these are the areas where I am struggling when trying to apply ICM. I played a few SnGs earlier just to fiddle with the calculator and try to ingrain the concept better and while it enlightened me as to how many spots I could push and be technically correct, it seemed to advocate too much aggression.

Just my opinions, im sure i have some of this wrong as i am only beginning to get involved in the topic but I would really like to hear as much as I can about this from people who have been using it for a long period of time.
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