Are Socialists Really Collectivistic?

[hmkpoker]

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The point of modern liberalism is not to keep people alive regardless of their contribution to society, it is to make as many people as possible productive.

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*stare*

I have no idea how I am supposed to respond to this one.

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That's because it runs against your fundamental view of maximizing social utility.

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No, it's because it is demonstrably false by science and common sense. If you genuinely believe that paying someone not to work will make them work more, I can't have a serious discussion with you.

Take a course on human behavior and/or human learning. You will be amazed by how Pavlovian it is. 100% of my Birkenstock-wearing, liberal hippie big state university psychology professors agreed to the paradigm that individuals, alone, act for self-motivated reasons, and that basic learning is shaped by self-internalized consequences.