Nutflush vs. Straightflush, can I fold here ever? $25PLO

[Boredom]

No reads on players except they're pretty bad but what can I put him on here? Had a bad feeling as soon as he checkraised the turn.


Hand #37040414-95867 at Coronado (Pot Limit Omaha)
Started at 28/Jan/07 07:53:47

Law Of One is at seat 0 with $15.25.
BreakUrHeart is at seat 1 with $39.65.
Racer_ X is at seat 2 with $25.05.
Jake_Camp is at seat 3 with $38.
moeBme is at seat 4 with $22.35.
hemiking57 is at seat 5 with $18.25.
The button is at seat 5.

Law Of One posts the small blind of $.10.
BreakUrHeart posts the big blind of $.25.

Law Of One: -- -- -- --
BreakUrHeart: -- -- -- --
Racer_ X: -- -- -- --
Jake_Camp: Ah Ad Kc 3h
moeBme: -- -- -- --
hemiking57: -- -- -- --

Pre-flop:

Racer_ X folds. Jake_Camp raises to $.85. moeBme
folds. hemiking57 calls. Law Of One folds.
BreakUrHeart calls.

Flop (board: Ks Qh 9h):

BreakUrHeart checks. Jake_Camp checks. hemiking57
checks.

Turn (board: Ks Qh 9h 8h):

BreakUrHeart checks. Jake_Camp bets $2. hemiking57
folds. BreakUrHeart raises to $8.65. Jake_Camp
re-raises to $28.60. BreakUrHeart goes all-in for
$38.80. Jake_Camp goes all-in for $37.15.
BreakUrHeart is returned $1.65 (uncalled).

River (board: Ks Qh 9h 8h 8s):

(no action in this round)




Showdown:

BreakUrHeart shows Jh 4h 9d Th.
BreakUrHeart has Jh Th Qh 9h 8h: straight flush, queen high.
Jake_Camp shows Ah Ad Kc 3h.
Jake_Camp has Ah 3h Qh 9h 8h: flush, ace high.


Hand #37040414-95867 Summary:

$3 is raked from a pot of $76.95.
BreakUrHeart wins $73.95 with straight flush, queen high.

[CrushinFelt]

No, to get away from these you need deeper stacks

[Professorn]

[ QUOTE ]
No, to get away from these you need deeper stacks

[/ QUOTE ]

waaaay deeper

[Slonye6]

Deeper than you will ever have.

[Brian O'Nolan]

What if this action occurred on a hypothetical brick river? That is, somehow the turn got checked around and hero ends up on the river with an A hi flush in a 10 BB pot. What could a c/r'ing villain have other than a straight flush?

[pete fabrizio]

[ QUOTE ]
What if this action occurred on a hypothetical brick river? That is, somehow the turn got checked around and hero ends up on the river with an A hi flush in a 10 BB pot. What could a c/r'ing villain have other than a straight flush?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it can definitely be right to fold a nut flush against a probable straight flush, especially on the river, and even without insanely deep stacks. But this is going to come up sooo infrequently that it doesn't really matter, and the people who (incorrectly) vow never to do so aren't losing much.

[crockpot]

[ QUOTE ]
Deeper than you will ever have.

[/ QUOTE ]

disagree, assuming you have a read that your opponent plays competently.

pot 5 BB, same board. you lead for half the pot, quite a normal bet size with the nut flush. he min-raises, also a normal action with the mortal nuts. now you pot it back to him, and he re-pots. this requires only 65 BB stacks and i can't see how calling is correct against a good player.

[haz31]

I agree with what pete said in that its such a rare situation it hardly matters, but to futher your example crockpot, if your opponent is intelligent and knows you view him as "plays compently", your tight and make big laydowns ie nutflush with only 1 straight flush possible, isn't this an insanely good spot to bluff with any of the straight flush hearts, or really any 4 considering that your going to have a straight flush like never?
This isn't something that i've really seen, but thats not to say there are opponents and situations where it wouldn't be a profitable play. Little OT from this thread but something worth thinking about.

[RoundTower]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with what pete said in that its such a rare situation it hardly matters, but to futher your example crockpot, if your opponent is intelligent and knows you view him as "plays compently", your tight and make big laydowns ie nutflush with only 1 straight flush possible, isn't this an insanely good spot to bluff with any of the straight flush hearts, or really any 4 considering that your going to have a straight flush like never?
This isn't something that i've really seen, but thats not to say there are opponents and situations where it wouldn't be a profitable play. Little OT from this thread but something worth thinking about.

[/ QUOTE ]
No. If your opponent is a huge nit and he thinks you are also a huge nit then you should bluff him a lot, but this is still pretty much the worst possible spot to pick to bluff.

[Silent A]

How about this variation on the theme:

Let's say the hand goes to the river relatively quietly because the players are fairly deep and the straight flush guy doesn't raise. Hero with the nut flush leads on the river and striaght flush villain raises.

Under what circumstances would you consider simply calling?