New Neteller Press release.

[HSB]

So this basically means nothing.

[tangled]

He pushed through a piece of legislation that takes away an activity that millions of Americans love, an activity that's an extension of our American heritage, without debate and with only a thirty minute warning, and maybe, you say, he thought he was doing the right thing. If he thought that was the right thing than he has no business being the most powerful man in the greatest legislative body in the history man. His handling of this legislation would make some dictators blush.

Not only that, How is it that he might think that online poker is so bad to be treated in such an extaordinary manner, but other forms of gambling, like horse racing, received no restrictions whatsoever?

I have no problem with treating even someone like Frist fairly, but this law's passing had everything to do with politics, not with right doing.

[Sixth_Rule]

I agree neteller is out of the US eventually

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Obviously add to these if I've forgotten any, but I can only think of three fears we have to deal with regarding Neteller's demise (IMO)...

Fear #1. We can no longer deposit.

Sites have continuously said that they will actively pursue as many new payment processing options as they can. They HAVE to pursue these options if they wish to stay in business like they have claimed. We will be able to deposit. Even if it isn't through Neteller, we will be able to deposit.

Fear #2. We won't be able to withdrawal.

If we can deposit, we should be able to w/d. I've been told that this part would be harder for banks to keep track of, but because that's not something set in stone, take it for what it is (speculation).

Fear #3. When it's harder to deposit, fish will give up.


This is hilarious. Fish will NOT give up. Not anymore than they would before. If a fish keeps losing, and keeps playing, he's as interested in continuing to play as we are. If he's losing, and stops playing, it wouldn't matter whether he could deposit or not. Some might say that not being able to deposit will be the final tipping point for certain fish, and it possibly could be. But, this will not be the case in drastic numbers.

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drastic is a funny term. I think the problem is the public persception of what is happening.

Fear 1) Fish will believe they are breaking the law and find other ways besided internet poker to get their fix.

Fear 2) Many fish will lose every way they knew before of putting money into online gambling and assume that their are no safe ways left to do it. They may think it is to much of a hassle to try and get their fix somewhere esle.

Fear 3) lets say 15% of people win in poker 15 percent break even and 70 % are losers over the long term. If America is vigilant in their new law and 50% of all US players stop playing, most of the players they lose WILL come from the losers a almost NO winners will leave (why wouldn't they find a way to continue making extra money)

[theghost]

Not to mention some of the new crop of payment processing sites that replace Neteller have the potential to be scams.

[KEW]

If Netteller does back out it will put the rest of the US in the same boat as us Narylanders...There are others ways and more ways are popping up...E-checks are be coming more and more popular..

[Sixth_Rule]

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Not to mention some of the new crop of payment processing sites that replace Neteller have the potential to be scams.

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Oh and i thought of another one as welll. Neteller is a Big Legit. One of the big ways this law could not be enforced is if companies like neteller said that it was none of thier buisness. Banks in the united states would then have to make the choice to stop making tranfers to neteller, who do other things besides gambling tranfers. THis would be a hard decision. But new suspect companies that pop up would be easier, once recongnised for what they were, to ban from doing buisness with US banks.

[joseki]

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Here is the important point to keep in mind: even *if* neteller later decides it can't transfer our money to a poker site for a deposit, nothing prohibits them from facilitating withdrawals from that site to us. So if either the banks get the Fed not to make the new regs such that ACH transactions (checks and e-checks) aren't regulated, OR different ways of depositing can be found like one time vehicles (phone cards) or Western Union to an individual in another country, then we are still in business.

Note too, that neteller's primary concern right now is keeping their current banking relationship, and they may well be casting about for a new one, after which they will again change policy. If neteller either doesn't do that, or doesn't wish to be just the withdrawal company while others provide deposits to poker sites, then it will simply not have a reason to exist as euros and canadians with certain exceptions, have never absolutely needed them as we americans have, since in countries where online poker isn't prohibited, other forms of money transfer are more easily available.

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Bluff, the most important piece of info in the release is...

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NETELLER, a company registered outside the US, will comply with the Act and its related regulations as if it were subject to the Act’s jurisdiction.

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This was not unexpected...

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Obviously add to these if I've forgotten any, but I can only think of three fears we have to deal with regarding Neteller's demise (IMO)...

Fear #1. We can no longer deposit.

Sites have continuously said that they will actively pursue as many new payment processing options as they can. They HAVE to pursue these options if they wish to stay in business like they have claimed. We will be able to deposit. Even if it isn't through Neteller, we will be able to deposit.

Fear #2. We won't be able to withdrawal.

If we can deposit, we should be able to w/d. I've been told that this part would be harder for banks to keep track of, but because that's not something set in stone, take it for what it is (speculation).

Fear #3. When it's harder to deposit, fish will give up.


This is hilarious. Fish will NOT give up. Not anymore than they would before. If a fish keeps losing, and keeps playing, he's as interested in continuing to play as we are. If he's losing, and stops playing, it wouldn't matter whether he could deposit or not. Some might say that not being able to deposit will be the final tipping point for certain fish, and it possibly could be. But, this will not be the case in drastic numbers.

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Reality #1. All of this [censored] is reducing the number of new fish. Most fish eventually quit, or at least slow way down. I believe that NEW FISH are the lifeblood of poker pros.

[f1954]

And just by coincidence, Neteller is offline right now. Probably overwhelmed by players checking in.

[brianmarc]

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Moneybookers will gladly accept your money, so will the sites using it as payment option (majority of them)

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Not so fast! While MB WILL allow you to upload funds from a US credit card, they will NOT allow you to transfer these proceeds to any gambling site.

[badblood44]

What if a "Pokerstars entity" opens up a legal Neteller account from the Isle of Man? Then I transfer funds from one Neteller account to that account. Then "Pokerstars entity" makes the deposit for me into my poker account?

Too transparent?