200PLO TP + flush draw overaggressive line?

[Vinetou]

PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha High, $2 BB (6 handed) Poker Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($220.65)
CO ($589.90)
Button ($208.45)
SB ($172.55)
BB ($218.60)
UTG ($43.85)

Preflop: Hero is MP with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $7</font>, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, SB calls $6, BB calls $5.

Flop: ($21) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets $12</font>, BB calls $12, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $67.95</font>, SB calls $55.95, BB calls $55.95.

Turn: ($224.85) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $145.7 (All-In)</font>,

Just browsing through old HH's and I found that hand. Villain donked into me before. I think I overplayed the hand. I should at least shut down on turn and probably just call the flop.

Generally, what does donk bet mean in Omaha? I know how to deal with them in Hold'em pretty well, but what hands they generally represent in Omaha? I am actually more worried about the caller in this hand. If there was just one villain, I think my play would be good. With two villains calling my raise on the flop, this is probably a spew. What do you think of my play here?

[iggymcfly]

Yeah, you're better off just calling on the flop. Heads-up, it's easier to think of it as a "donk-bet" and make more hold'em type adjustments, but in a three-way pot, it could be anything from a weak draw trying to pick up the pot to the nuts with a redraw.

On the turn, you definitely, definitely need to check. Both BB and SB are repping sets here and at least one of them is going to have one. You're getting both players to fold &lt;10% of the time here and you're never getting in ahead on the turn so just be happy to take your free card.

[2handed]

Raising the flop is a little gambly without a few more outs. I would do it if I had a gutshot or 2pair to go with NFD.

Calling the flop is fine because you are getting proper direct odds on your draw, and you are giving them the opportunity to stack off and if they want to stack off they are going to be a favorite with almost any reasonable stackoff holding (2pair/set+flush draw or straight).

Donkbets don't just mean one thing, it is pretty player dependant. I know players who whenever they donkbet are dying for you to raise so they can 3bet, and others who do it in order to get info with a weak or medium strength hand.
Some do both, generally the better players.

On a board where an obvious made hand is possible I am very wary about raising a donkbet with a pure draw since your fold equity is pretty slim.

[Vinetou]

"On a board where an obvious made hand is possible I am very wary about raising a donkbet with a pure draw since your fold equity is pretty slim."

So you usually wouldn't do it even against one opponent?

[2handed]

[ QUOTE ]
"On a board where an obvious made hand is possible I am very wary about raising a donkbet with a pure draw since your fold equity is pretty slim."

So you usually wouldn't do it even against one opponent?

[/ QUOTE ]

I usually would not do it against one opponent. Obviously there are exceptions, but I think this donkbet is pretty strong, and you are never in great shape against his range. I guess if I know he is a weaktight and is going to checkfold a blank on turn I may be more inclined. But with just the NFD, meh I don't really like it.

FWIW In a cap PLO game like the 40bb one on FTP it think raising the flop here is standard.

[Grandezza]

"On a board where an obvious made hand is possible I am very wary about raising a donkbet with a pure draw since your fold equity is pretty slim."

Why is this? I'm not sure I get it. Because he knows he appears weak and you raising represents a small range? This not might be true but I could imagine a lot of players thinking you would only raise the straight or a very big draw here.

[Big Dave D]

Clearly calling the flop is better, however the fact they both calls makes the raise ok. The turn bet is very likely to be called, often by people who think they are trying to outdraw your straight. Certainly the number of guys who can pass a set in that spot is a number approaching zero. And just occassionally, you will get a timid straight in there too. So the free card on the turn is OK.

In all, this feels like a NLHE style of play.

gl

bdd

[OrrLives]

I usually use the term 'donk bet' for a bet of ~1/3 pot or less into a preflop raiser. The SB bet out 60% of the pot, which (to me) says he has a decent hand but not the nuts. But a bet like this can mean many things... it really depends on the person who does it.

About the hand, I can't really add that much more than what has been said already. I prefer a call on the flop because you may only be drawing to the nut flush draw.

As played, check the turn. I don't think you can get them both to fold here. Even against just the SB, he would be getting over 2-to-1 and might call with just two pair here.

[Vinetou]

Results: BB had the nut straight, and I think he played it bad. He had Ad8dKs7c. SB had 8cAcTd8s. He definitely play bad. They both called me.

[Elrazor]

SB played the nut straight pretty much as i would in this spot - lead out on the flop and wait for a safe turn before comitting. the only thing i would do differently is lead out on the turn. i think its pretty standard to call the flop, especially against 2 players