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#1
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Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
I was wondering how position determines raise sizing in NL full ring games. If you are in early position (UTG-MP1), and have a premium hand such as AKs or JJ, do you tend to raise more or less than you would with the same hand in late position? I know that there are many other things to consider when determining raise sizs such as looseness of opponents, # of limpers, postflop SPRs, etc. But I am just curious how position alone dicates raise sizes.
I have heard two arguments that conflict each other: (1) is that you should raise MORE in early position because you dont want to play a hand OOP and would prefer to take it down now. (2) is that you should raise LESS in EP to keep the pot smaller since you will be OOP th rest of the hand. I used to subscribe to (1) but now think that it is the incorrect one. It seems to leave value at the table because you are giving opponents exra incentive to fold when you have a premium hand, and causes you to build a bigger pot OOP, which is not good at all. (2) is beginning to make more sense to me as the better strategy. I would appreciate it if some of the mor experienced players out there could give opinions/insight into this. Thanks guys. |
#2
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
if you raise less in EP, you encourage action from people IP on you
I like 4x as default utg-mp3(maybe co) and 3x on the CO/BTN |
#3
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
[ QUOTE ]
if you raise less in EP, you encourage action from people IP on you [/ QUOTE ] Would you not prefer action with premiums, even OOP - as opposed to more frequent folds? |
#4
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] if you raise less in EP, you encourage action from people IP on you [/ QUOTE ] Would you not prefer action with premiums, even OOP - as opposed to more frequent folds? [/ QUOTE ] It really depends on what type of game you are in and what reads you have on your opponents. There are some opponents that will call a 10X raise utg and will commit theirselves by calling a flop bet Then you have some tables that will fold around to MR utg. The other thing to consider is how you personally are able to play your big pairs post flop and whether you are able to extract maximum value based on their holding or if are unable to lay it down when needed. I like the standard 4x myself and i'll sometimes mix up my PFR utg with different hands and raise amounts, but rarely. |
#5
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
My experience is it doesn't matter much overall, as long as your consistent.
What I mean by this is for the most part: Same size betting == Betting less early == betting more early in terms of overall profitability. This is true at least for nl100 and below, and probably nl200 too. Going through all the reasons why one is better than another is worthwhile though to help your thinking about the game and others that do this, and would be a good pooh-bah post for someone. |
#6
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
i raise 4xBB from any position if I'm opening the pot because i want to maintain consistency.
I used to raise 3x in EP but once i had one caller it would become easier for a second, then the BB gets in on the action too. BTN i sometimes just do 3xBB when the players in the blind are tight and will let me steal their blinds all day |
#7
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
When all is said and done, this is probably pretty true in terms of online poker. There is only so much latitude offered by the table. 3x and 4x get calls and 5x just doesn't. So, given the small number of choices, there just can't be that much difference.
Live is a whole other kettle of fish. Full ring live offers remarkable latitude on preflop raise sizing and good preflop bet sizing can have a large impact on your overall results. |
#8
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] if you raise less in EP, you encourage action from people IP on you [/ QUOTE ] Would you not prefer action with premiums, even OOP - as opposed to more frequent folds? [/ QUOTE ] because premium hands preflop often aren't premium postflop, AKs is going to be no pair no fd around half the time, QQ/JJ will have overcards on a fair amount of flops by discourage action, I mean make it a little tougher for them to call ip and [censored] with you postflop, where they can often induce you to make big mistakes |
#9
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
The "bet pot" button is my best friend
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#10
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Re: Strat Question: pf raise sizing w/ premium hands in EP
[ QUOTE ]
The "bet pot" button is my best friend [/ QUOTE ] I'll admit I haven't read anything in this thread yet, but is it really any more complicated than this? I mean really, is it? |
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