Standard Shove Scenerios

JanelleBB7 · #1 10-03-2007, 07:42 AM

So I hear this a lot from the 2+2 posters: "Standard". But the problem is I don't know what situations are all standard. I hope I don't get flamed for this idea, but I would like to know if we could develop a list of standard shove scenerios (on the turn or flop). This could really help me in my game. I would like to have a clear list in my head of plays that are just plain standard. It may be the ABC's to you guys but I am not sure how you all always know what is standard.

Elrazor · #2 10-03-2007, 09:27 AM

mm pretty wide ranging question, but i have a couple of examples over the last session or so where you might think im behind in both hands but by shoving i actually found myself in a decent spot - in general terms when someone says a hand is standard it generally means that both players are going to stack off here regardless, as their hand/draw is so strong.

FullTiltPoker Game #3743081690: Table Spunsilk (6 max) - $0.50/$1 - Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 7:19:30 ET - 2007/10/03
Seat 1: Mr Hakahill ($130)
Seat 2: rubberduck2 ($73.05)
Seat 3: El-Razor ($100.70)
Seat 4: Scooper of Life ($148.80)
Seat 5: micelanya ($82.45)
micelanya posts the small blind of $0.50
Mr Hakahill posts the big blind of $1

Dealt to El-Razor [7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]

rubberduck2 calls $1
El-Razor raises to $4.50
Scooper of Life folds
micelanya calls $4
Mr Hakahill folds
rubberduck2 calls $3.50

*** FLOP *** [4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]

micelanya checks
rubberduck2 checks
El-Razor bets $14.50
micelanya raises to $58
rubberduck2 folds
El-Razor raises to $96.20, and is all in
micelanya calls $19.95, and is all in

micelanya shows [7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]]
Uncalled bet of $18.25 returned to El-Razor

*** TURN *** [4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]] [K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]]

*** RIVER *** [4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]] [4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]]

El-Razor shows two pair, Sevens and Fours
micelanya shows two pair, Eights and Sevens
micelanya wins the pot ($167.40) with two pair, Eights and Sevens

in this hand i flop a great draw, c/bet it and get check raised - most beginners would automacally think straight here and think they are behind, but my hand is actually 65/35 fav, versus both the made straight and villans actual hand, 2 pair - in fact i am ahead of virtually concevable hand hand here except AAxxwc where i am 48/52, but the dead money already in the pot more than compensates for this. as a side note when you are playing around the 100bb mark it is usually correct to get all your money in the middle with AAxx w/NFD, as if you are up against a set you are usually no worse than 2-1 dog, and random 2 pairs are normally slightly better than a coin flip

in the second hand im the guy stacking off with AA - with not decent wrap available i thought i might be up against a set here, but yet again i give my opponent too much credit and he turns up with 2 pair and a rubbish flush, and im actually a marginal 52/48 fav

FullTiltPoker Game #3726039207: Table Garden (6 max) - $0.50/$1 - Pot Limit Omaha Hi - 14:59:54 ET - 2007/10/01
Seat 1: Invie ($185.15)
Seat 2: RUIZAV ($76.80)
Seat 3: PrimeFknTime ($154.55)
Seat 4: nickyb2350 ($99)
Seat 5: iamnotkit ($195.15)
Seat 6: El-Razor ($89.70)
Invie posts the small blind of $0.50
RUIZAV posts the big blind of $1

Dealt to El-Razor [9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]c A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]h A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]
PrimeFknTime calls $1
nickyb2350 calls $1
iamnotkit folds
El-Razor raises to $5.50
Invie calls $5
RUIZAV folds
PrimeFknTime calls $4.50
nickyb2350 calls $4.50

*** FLOP *** [8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]

Invie checks
PrimeFknTime checks
nickyb2350 checks
El-Razor bets $23
Invie calls $23
PrimeFknTime folds
nickyb2350 raises to $93.50, and is all in
El-Razor calls $61.20, and is all in
Invie folds

nickyb2350 shows [J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]]

*** TURN *** [8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]] [2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]

*** RIVER *** [8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]
[K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]]

nickyb2350 shows a flush, King high
El-Razor shows a flush, Ace high
El-Razor wins the pot ($211.40) with a flush, Ace high

TimberBee · #3 10-03-2007, 11:28 AM

Good post and good hands Elrazor

NooBster · #4 10-03-2007, 12:21 PM

Janelle,

Recently, I've seen you a lot at the full rings games on PS, but just haven't had the chance to sit with you for too long. Anyhow, here are a couple hands from yesterday that I believe are pretty standard shove situations.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1546901

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1546912

G/L to you at the tables

Elrazor · #5 10-03-2007, 12:52 PM

i think stacking off with AAxx NFD is always ok, but i wouldnt say its super standard to felt TPNFD at a full table?? i think its abit too opponent/situation dependent to be totally standard

Elrazor · #6 10-03-2007, 01:04 PM

ok about as standard as you are going to get - reraiser has top set with nothing showing so he has every reason to stack off, ive got a wrap/flush which actually makes me 58/42 favorite in this spot.

and for once i actually hit [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Full Tilt Poker
Pot Limit Omaha Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $95
UTG+1: $119.35
CO: $97.30
Hero: $146.90
SB: $188.10
BB: $93.50

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, CO raises to $4.5, Hero calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($22.5, 5 players)
SB checks, BB bets $22.5, UTG+1 raises to $90, CO folds, Hero raises all-in $142.4, 2 folds, UTG+1 calls all-in $24.85.
Uncalled bets: $27.55 returned to Hero.

Turn: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($182.35, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $274.7)

River: 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($182.35, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: $274.7)

Results:
Final pot: $182.35
UTG+1 showed 9s 7s 7c 2c
Hero showed 8d 9h 5h 6c