Big Pots = Big Leaks at 10NL... Help!

ev_slave · #1 09-17-2007, 01:09 PM

Hi guys. Everyone knows that it's not about the number of pots you rake, but the size of the pots you do rake. Lately, I've been doing a pretty good job at setting up and taking down medium to small pots, but it feels like everytime I end up in a big pot I'm a big loser. Some of those taking them down against me are not strong players, so I feel that although I'm being outplayed on some, it's definitely not all of them, so there's probably something wrong with how I'm approaching these pots and how I'm approaching the problem.

I've included six hands below: some I've won, some I've lost. The specific results are not important... the line I take in getting to the results is. Please take a look and tell me where I may be going wrong on some of these hands (a bet that is only called if beat... etc.) This is a major leak that works hard to trash my winrate - I've been breakeven and I think fixing this could bump me up to a 3PTBB/100 winner (or even more... losing 60 BBs when you can lose 15BB is a big difference in winrate!)

Thanks in advance. Without further ado...

[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hand 1

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls, Button calls, SB folds, BB checks.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($0.45, 4 players)
BB checks, UTG bets $0.1, Hero raises to $0.4, Button folds, BB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($1.65, 3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $2, BB raises to $4, UTG folds, Hero raises all-in $9.5, BB calls.

River: 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($20.65, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $20.65)

Results:
Final pot: $20.65

[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Hand 2

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, Hero raises to $0.5, Button raises to $1.35, 3 folds, Hero raises all-in $10.95, Button calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($22.15, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $22.15)

Turn: A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($22.15, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $22.15)

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($22.15, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $22.15)

Results:
Final pot: $22.15

[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Hand 3

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
4 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (4 players) Hero is UTG with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero raises to $0.4, Button calls, 2 folds.

Flop: 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($0.95, 2 players)
Hero bets $0.6, Button calls.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($2.15, 2 players)
Hero bets $1.5, Button calls.

River: 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($5.15, 2 players)
Hero bets $3, Button raises to $6, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: $17.15

[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Hand 4

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
Hero raises to $0.4, UTG+1 calls, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($1.65, 4 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.7, UTG+1 folds, CO calls, BB folds.

Turn: 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($3.05, 2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $1.7, Hero calls.

River: T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($6.45, 2 players)
Hero bets $2.5, CO raises all-in $10.7, Hero calls all-in $5.8.
Uncalled bets: $2.4 returned to CO.

Results:
Final pot: $23.05

[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hand 5

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.4, BB calls.

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($0.85, 3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.5, BB raises to $2.5, Hero raises all-in $9.4, BB calls.

Turn: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($19.65, 2 players + 1 all-in - Main pot: $19.65)

River: 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($19.65, 2 players + 1 all-in - Main pot: $19.65)

Results:
Final pot: $19.65

[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Hand 6

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
5 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, Hero raises to $0.4, SB folds, BB calls.

Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($0.85, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.6, BB raises to $1.7, Hero calls.

Turn: 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($4.25, 2 players)
BB bets $2.8, Hero calls.

River: 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($9.85, 2 players)
BB is all-in $5.1, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: $20.05

mookboi · #2 09-17-2007, 01:26 PM

You need to include stack sizes for all these hands. Stack sizes are like the most important thing in any hand.

Hand 1: Limping is meh, raise preflop. I might consider just calling this flop, because it's a pretty safe flop for us and we aren't really afraid of the turn & want more money in pot. Turn good.

Hand 2: Meh, with QQ I usually call & CRAI a safe flop. But this is ok.

Hand 3: Depending on how much he got left, I might push him in, but most of the time call river. Other then that, standard. nh.

Hand 4: Bet more on flop. Like 1/2 at least. Fold turn. Lead for more on river. Or go for CRAI.

Hand 5: Hate this shove. He's not calling you with like KJ usually, so if he calls you are probably beat. It depends on player. I don't know if typical unknown would call this at 10NL with lesser hand. I just call his raise and probably c/f turn.

Hand 6: Same situation as hand 5 on flop, no? I probably fold turn, it completed lota draws + he's showing strength.

Overall, you seem to be doing pretty well. Work on bet sizing. Also please don't take above advice as final. Stack sizes are very important, I cannot stress this enough. Stack sizes of villain & your own should dictate how you play, as well as what hands you choose to play preflop.

ev_slave · #3 09-17-2007, 04:27 PM

Sorry... the converter is supposed to show stack sizes. I'll fix this this afternoon.

CobraGoat · #4 09-17-2007, 04:42 PM

wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy too many hands posted at once.

hand 1- do not limp in MP w suited As, raise or fold, in that position, i fold. as played, felt that all day.

2- villain dependent. you are an early raiser of an UTG limper which is a fairly strong line. villain now RRs you? i think you could call and see a flop, fold or minR and fold to shove. shoving there gets called by KK, AA and AK, bad range for you.

3- fine but c/c the river to induce the bluff/keep pot smaller against better hands.

4- lol if you lost that hand to Js full or quads. again, get as much money in on that river as possible.

5- tough. AK w heart im a lot happier getting in than KQ. but im either folding or shoving.

6- fold the turn, quick, everydraw got there if you weren't beat already.

bsball8806 · #5 09-17-2007, 05:08 PM

1. hate the PF limp, please raise or fold. postflop is fine.
2. don't like the huge raise, we are only called by worse and occasionally AKs.
3. hand 3 is good.
4. I fold the turn (to what seems like Jx), but after that is fine
5. fold hand 5 to the c/r. its clear he wants to be AI on that flop, which means we beat nothing in his range.
6. i might call c/r on the flop, but i probably fold the turn and definitely fold the river.

overall, i'd give more credit to those who c/r you, especially since you don't have TK to go along with your top pair. it seems like you don't like letting go of good hands once you've committed money to the pot

anthb7210p · #6 09-17-2007, 05:17 PM

hand 5 and 6 look like huge spews. Your calling raises too lightly

OatmealJoe · #7 09-17-2007, 05:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
hand 5 and 6 look like huge spews. Your calling raises too lightly

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. There are some things that could be done on the other hands, but 5 and 6 seem easy to get away from.

Jw513 · #8 09-17-2007, 05:26 PM

Hand 1: Don't limp preflop. Everything else looks good.
Hand 2: Don't like the all in, cuz we only beat jacks and we flip with AK. If they call you, you're prolly beat. Only do this if villain is short, like under 50 bb
Hand 3: Looks good. Looks like you lost on the river, but you can't fold here.
Hand 4: Fold the turn, but you got lucky, so ship it!
Hand 5: This probably would depend on opponent, but I think he might have a draw, so folding or shoving.
Hand 6: Fold on turn. It doesn't look like he's going to fold to a shove. If you can't fold turn, you HAVE to fold at the river. Theres no way you are winning.

ev_slave · #9 09-18-2007, 09:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Theres no way you are winning.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not this month. I agree that 6 is atrocious. This was at least partially tilt-induced. No excuse.

Anyway, thanks for all the input. Many made great points about how to think through these situations, and hopefully I'll be making more money than the ~3PTBB/100 that I get from rakeback soon.

Thanks again everyone.

johndenver · #10 09-18-2007, 09:42 PM

do u use pahud? I think it helps alot knowing who's raises u should be respecting

also, 5 & 6 are horrible, put a postit on your monitor that says dont get stacked with tpgk to remind urself