200nl hand vs skater87 2p2

[Don Key E37]

Ok skater87 has decided to rejoin the 200nl tables at full tilt to my dissmay. I think its Dan Bitel from here and he is a solid thinking player from what I've read and the little I've played with him. He seemed to be following me and was on 4 of my 5 tables for quite a while tonight and (maybe I made another buddy list [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. It seems like he's been giving my 3 bets some respect folding to them most of the time, and with good reason because I wasn't 3betting him light much. I have him right around 21/17 and definetly plays much looser in late position. I thought this was an interesting hand and I think many streets are debateable, if not all of them. I told him I'd post this hand and would like to hear thoughts before I give my thinking thoughout the hand. Oh and from his perspective I was running around 21/15 tonight and hadn't gotten out of line much (it was earlier in the night [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].


Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $1/$2
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $254
UTG+1: $141.05
CO: $226.40
Hero: $365.05
SB: $201
BB: $205.30

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is Button with 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">CO raises to $7</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $24</font>, 2 folds, CO calls.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($51, 2 players)
CO checks, Hero checks.

Turn: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($51, 2 players)
CO checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $37</font>, CO calls.

River: 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($125, 2 players)
CO checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $97[/color

[Nielsio]

You're trying to bluff queens representing ..?

[BDaws]

[ QUOTE ]
You're trying to bluff queens representing AA, AK, TT?

[/ QUOTE ]

[inverted]

Yea, Im pretty sure thats dbitel. My guess is he called you with Queens or Jacks.

[FishSticks]

Repping Kx/TT/66/AA/QQ I suppose.

As played I don't think he get many better hands to fold on the river. 99 you'll likely fold out here. JJ/QQ generally call. Tx is unlikely given preflop. Anything worse than your hand is not very likely to call, so I don't see a lot of value here.

On this flop paired board flop, after this preflop action - I don't really like your flop/turn line. If I'm betting, I'll bet the flop and most turns because I think many folks will call flop and fold turn with 99-JJ here (maybe not this villain but randoms). If he AQ or whatever other unpaired cards he'll generally just give up (and sometimes try a bluff c/r).

If I check the flop, I'm generally checking back the turn again. The stuff we're losing to won't fold the turn, and the stuff we're beating doesn't have any great drawing power.

A lot of it depends on the villain and dynamics with these paired board situations.

[carrotsnake]

puke :/ really really don't like this, I'd also consider preflop bad

[BDaws]

[ QUOTE ]
I'd also consider preflop bad

[/ QUOTE ]
Ya, 88 is a great hand to call on the button isn't it? Why 3 bet and make stacks shallower postflop?

[fees]

I hate bluffing here

[Don Key E37]

Preflop may be bad. I don't really think so but I usually call here and raise like 3 out of 10. I don't want people thinking I never rr the button with pairs less than 99.

Now on to the rest of the hand. What I think some of you may not be thinking about is that he pretty much CANT have a king here. We weren't that deep and he's not calling me OOP with ak or kq here, he's going to 4 bet or fold. And I haven't played with him a ton but I think I'm probably getting 4 bet here like at least 70% of the time by QQ. So seeing as how he almost never has a king and doubt he has QQ if you did have ak kq or AA QQ would you bet the flop? You may get c/r by 77-jj and have to fold QQ mabye AA if you bet and your getting no value with only a 2 outer to worry about by betting your king.

He knows he can't have a king here, and I think his range is pretty easy to peg once he calls the turn. Which you would have to bet with pretty much any of the hands I'm repping. So onto the river. What would you bet with ak,kq aa qq here? He pretty much can't have better unless he's pulling off a sick triple check then raise move, and I doubt it. I thought shoving looked like I wanted a fold and went with what I went with. I'm not saying I played the hand well, just thought it might make for some good discussion seeing as how we can put him in a pretty small range, and still not know what to do. His range to me here is 77 99-QQ, AA. Being heavily weighted toward 99-JJ, and I think he knows we know this. So thats that and I'll take my rips and see what you guys think.

edit to say that I do think we win here like never if we check.