Misplayed on every street?

[private joker]

I've been having nightmares about this hand since Friday. You guys can create a poll if you want to debate which street is more horrific.

Backdrop: I'd just had a rush of premium starting hands, so I'd been raising a lot PF, which, in a game like the Commerce 20, calls attention to itself.

So I get 88 UTG and open-limp this time. Pots have been super-multiway, so I wasn't too worried.

Of course it gets folded to MP2 who raises, button cold-calls, BB calls.

Flop is 655. Checked to me and I donk. MP2 raises, button folds, BB cold-calls. (Quick reads: both are total unknowns; weekend tourists I've never seen before, been playing with them less than 30 minutes). I call.

Turn is 9. BB now donks. I call. MP2 calls.

River is a 4. BB now checks. I check. MP2 quickly bets, BB quickly calls... so I fold.

[MitchL]

I think its fine honestly.

[StrictlyStrategy]

You're up against a 5 like 90% and 87 10% of the time here when he leads that turn. That's the uber fish ILL DISGUISE MY HAND BY JUST CALLING line.

So you could fold the river UI pretty comfortably here.

[ProfessorBen]

[ QUOTE ]
You're up against a 5 like 90% and 87 10% of the time here when he leads that turn. That's the uber fish ILL DISGUISE MY HAND BY JUST CALLING line.

So you could fold the river UI pretty comfortably here.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is wrong. Combo hands and 9's do this a large amount of time too. I don't know what 20/40 games you've been playing.

[rafiki]

think we shed MP2 on the turn with the raise ? It's pretty result oriented, but raising the turn can we interesting with 6 outs to the winner, a shot at a free showntown, and the chance to knock out MP2's better hand.

But to be honest the first time I read it, I couldn't find a lot of places I would have done something differently.

[MitchL]

[ QUOTE ]
think we shed MP2 on the turn with the raise ? It's pretty result oriented, but raising the turn can we interesting with 6 outs to the winner, a shot at a free showntown, and the chance to knock out MP2's better hand.

But to be honest the first time I read it, I couldn't find a lot of places I would have done something differently.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pretty sure raising turn is bad. Too much action went in on flop. When he bets turn he is going to showdown and with nothing less than a 9.

[quant_trader]

I am actually surprised that no one is having any issue with open limping with 88 even UTG.

I would've raised on turn trying to knock MP2 out and trying to get a free showdown. As played, folding river is fine, but I usually pay off, since that's what I do.

[ProfessorBen]

[ QUOTE ]
I am actually surprised that no one is having any issue with open limping with 88 even UTG.

I would've raised on turn trying to knock MP2 out and trying to get a free showdown. As played, folding river is fine, but I usually pay off, since that's what I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Limping 88 is a good choice and maybe even standard UTG given the description of the game.

Also, raising the turn is HORRIBLE when we get 3-bet and happens alot on this board when BB has a 5, 87, 99/66 or when MP has 99, because we need to call for our ~6 outs.

Edit: He has these holdings ALOT because of his flop CC and the board texture.

[emerson]

[ QUOTE ]
I am actually surprised that no one is having any issue with open limping with 88 even UTG.

I would've raised on turn trying to knock MP2 out and trying to get a free showdown. As played, folding river is fine, but I usually pay off, since that's what I do.

[/ QUOTE ]

Most of the time I like the raise, but not in the case he described. He's been getting lots of good starting hands and has been raising with great frequency lately. With 88 there are two types of pots you want: heads up or as many players as possible. With his recent raising frequency even the UTG raise will get less respect and is unlikely to fold out most of the field. So limping in and hoping to get good set odds is a good alternative here.

[ProfessorBen]

I think not 3-betting the flop is the biggest mistake. You really need to find out whether MP has an overpair, whether people have a 5 and you have to charge the people who are drawing esp. because you have some of their outs.

As played, I think the rest of the hand is fine, though I'm tempted to b/f the river. On the river, all you beat is an overcards bluff by MP2 and 76/86/FDand6 combo by BB. It happens some of the time, but the pot is relatively small because of the way you played this hand preflop/flop, so I doubt this situation occurs 1/12 times. If it does, it's close. If this did happen, deal with with PJ. Tanya says you fume alot when you make bad decisions. Learn to become tiltless.

I think one thing I'm starting to pick up is that turn donks followed by river checks almost often mean a combo hand that improved on the turn. Obviously, this could be either 9x or 6x with x being 7 or 8, which means there's no gurantee that you are still not ahead.