50NL Extracting value with these monsters

[Miyogi]

So for both hands I'm interested in trying to get the most value. In hand one villian is just typical fish (60/8/2.5)and we don't have a history. In hand two I had 3 bet villian (18/13/3.5)a couple hands before and took the pot down with a CB.

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $31.10
BB: $29.40
UTG: $57.40
MP: $58.75
Miyogi (CO): $104.75
BTN: $54.50

Preflop: Miyogi is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A (6 Players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $1.00</font>, MP folds, <font color="red">Miyogi raises to $4.00</font>, 3 folds, UTG calls $3.00

Flop: ($8.75) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
UTG checks, <font color="red">Miyogi bets $8.25</font>, <font color="red">UTG raises to $16.50</font>, <font color="red">Miyogi raises all-in to $100.75</font>

Pot Size: $126.00



Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $34.00
BB: $47.75
UTG: $50.00
MP: $87.00
Miyogi (CO): $57.00
BTN: $86.55

Preflop: Miyogi is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (6 Players)
2 folds, <font color="red">Miyogi raises to $2.00</font>, BTN calls $2.00, SB folds, BB calls $1.50

Flop: ($6.25) J 7 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Miyogi bets $4.25</font>, <font color="red">BTN raises to $8.50</font>, BB folds, Miyogi calls $4.25

Turn: ($23.25) 8 (2 Players)
Miyogi checks, <font color="red">BTN bets $14.00</font>, <font color="red">Miyogi raises to $31.50</font>

Pot Size: $68.75

[BackdoorQuads]

Hand 1: I think he's calling you with most overpairs and sets. It looks like you're good most of the time, I like it.

Hand 2: What do you put villain on? I think sets and overpairs will go to the felt on the flop. With something like AJ/KJ (rare, because it would be the case jack) or maybe even 99-TT, I think you get the most value with your line. I like it.

[Triggerle]

Hand 1 I think you can string him along for at least another street. An 8% PFR guy will usually not raise a small pp UTG so with the flop action you are looking at JJ+ or AK played badly.

Hand 2 is fine IMO.

[skoldpadda]

I think both are fine. What do you do on the first hand if you simply smooth call his min-raise and a 5,6,J,Q, or K comes up? There are a lot of potential scare cards on the turn. I like the push.

I think you should shove that turn on the 2nd hand -- obviously you're pot committed with the bet and the villain is calling off his stack if he's calling the smaller bet anyway.

[Triggerle]

[ QUOTE ]
I think both are fine. What do you do on the first hand if you simply smooth call his min-raise and a 5,6,J,Q, or K comes up? There are a lot of potential scare cards on the turn. I like the push.

[/ QUOTE ]

He likely has 2 outs. Even though we don't know which cards this are I feel that we lose a lot of value by protecting against such an unlikely draw with a push.

[r2me]

HAND 1: Call flop raise &amp; wait for next street to spring the trap. Maybe this is a leak in my game, but I think a fish will be more likely to call a smaller bet next st than your all in.

[ajmargarine]

I like both given stated reads.

[hunt1897]

Hand 1. what is he raising with? You are beat or he has a draw, I think calling here is fine. You blew him off the pot.

Hand 2. Similiar situation, except this Villian is a much better player based on stats and play, you induced a bluff or value bet (from his point of view) on turn, call here if you want to risk it. Maximum value comes with some risk.



Please don't post results so soon.

[Miyogi]

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1. what is he raising with? You are beat or he has a draw, I think calling here is fine. You blew him off the pot.

Hand 2. Similiar situation, except this Villian is a much better player based on stats and play, you induced a bluff or value bet (from his point of view) on turn, call here if you want to risk it. Maximum value comes with some risk.



Please don't post results so soon.

[/ QUOTE ]

I didn't post the results yet so I don't know what you mean by so soon? Hand one villian minraised preflop and called my 3bet. Occasionally fish do this with any two but usually it means strength. My thought on this hand was do I b3b or stack a donk.

Hand 2 I have top set and only a horribly played 910 beats me. Why are you suggesting I fold so I don't risk it? My thought on this hand was do I check raise the turn or check call the turn and lead on the river. The c/r gets me more money when he has a fairly strong hand AJ, QQ etc. but calling the turn and leading out will get me more value i think from hands like QJ or lower pocket pairs. If he has a set or the straight we get AI regardless.

[hunt1897]

Pot size reveals results sir, if you know what to look for.
Hand 2. Our opinion's are the same. Don't be offended, is english your first language?